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[Music]

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hello everyone and welcome to the show

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i'm martin willis your host uh we have

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someone on this evening actually as a

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crow flies we're only about

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60 miles apart he's in massachusetts i'm

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down in uh the cape right now um and

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it's chris pittman um he is basically a

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ufo historian i heard him uh back on the

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bridgewater triangle movie and then also

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on the phenomenon that uh james fox

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movie so i'm really excited to have him

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on he's looked at this subject

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since about the 1990s

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and uh great great guy

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anyway uh so next week uh this thursday

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actually i'm leaving for

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my friend and i are leaving for arizona

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we're gonna be out at the mufon boot

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camp

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and uh next week we'll be filming a

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whole bunch of us

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uh from right there it should be a lot

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of fun i think mark d'antonio might

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actually be joining us and perhaps uh

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matthew roberts might be uh past guest

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also who lives nearby might be joining

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us and uh i know alejandro shows up

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there now and then i'm not sure if he's

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going to be there that would be great if

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i could actually get him on just a

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couple of other things uh

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this week's blog uh by charles lear it's

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actually a repost and it's uh

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we put it up for halloween because it's

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the kelly kentucky ufo goblins so uh

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that's about the um the hopkinsville

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uh encounter very strange one with uh

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shooting at these things whatever they

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are and and uh scared they were scared

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all night i had um the daughter of

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someone uh that was there

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on this show at one point it's just a

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fascinating case if you haven't looked

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into that if you're new looking at this

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topic you want to google that one the

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the hopkinsville encounter ufo encounter

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and i think that said i do want to thank

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everyone that supports the show anyone

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can do that over at podcast

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podcastufo.com

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and uh let's see just one other thing on

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september i'm sorry november going

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backwards here november

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16th

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actually november 17th

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was 10 years ago was my very first show

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show number one episode number one with

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steve bassett he was the only one of all

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the people i reached out to that

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actually agreed to be on my first show

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so i'm going to repost that on the date

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on november 17th but our regular

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scheduled show is november 16

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and i'm going to have all kinds of

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guests on that uh

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luis

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gimez is uh scheduled to be the guest

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but we're going to have all kinds of

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people stop in and say hi that's on

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november 6th the 10th anniversary show

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and i hope some longtime listeners uh

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call in as well on that so for right now

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i'm going to bring in the guest tonight

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chris pittman welcome to the show chris

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whoops i'm not hearing you chris you

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uh oh

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um so try your your it shows that you're

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not muted so i'm not really sure what

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happened um whoops he's gone he will be

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back i trust the fact that he will be

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back and uh bill you might want to get

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ready just in case

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might have to bring you in so uh that's

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what i love about live shows it keeps

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keeps me on my toes i never know what's

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really going to happen chris is coming

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back

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and we're going to try to add him right

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now all right chris try you mike now can

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you hear me yeah i can hear you

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perfectly yes cool sorry about that yeah

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that's fine thank you so much for

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joining us

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like i said i've been really excited to

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have you on uh you did a great job also

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on the phenomenon that was a that was a

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really good clip your part in that as

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well and i remember reaching out to

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james fox i said james can i have

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chris chris's uh information and and uh

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but he was just so busy at the time i

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was never able to get it so if you would

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for the person that has no idea who you

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are there's a few of them out there but

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a lot of people know who you are but can

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you give your background

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basically and what got you interested in

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this topic and speaking of background i

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love your background

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oh thank you a bunker back

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yeah yeah my old stuff

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so basically um i'm 42 years old i'm

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from massachusetts i've lived in

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massachusetts most of my life

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and i got interested in ufos when i was

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a child i read

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a book that my grandfather had on his

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shelf the report on unidentified flying

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objects by edward repelt

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and that book as a child absolutely

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captivated my imagination

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and i read that book cover to cover i

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read it so many times it became

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dog-eared and the cover fell off but it

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wasn't until i was a teenager that i

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really got interested in investigating

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ufo sightings myself

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um

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it started around 1993 i became

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absolutely obsessed with the idea of

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finding out where ufos come from and i

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back this was like a pre-internet era so

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it was all snail mail i joined all of

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the ufo study organizations that would

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have me as a member

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um and i got involved with mufon and i

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became a member and an investigator for

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the local chapter of mufon and during

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the throughout the 1990s i investigated

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ufo sightings uh in many places in the

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united states and canada but mostly

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right here in new england where i live

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and after doing that for a little while

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i

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really my focus and then of course

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eventually i got involved with the

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bridgewater triangle which is kind of

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the local anomalous area a lot of ufo

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sightings and other high strangeness

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stuff reported there and um you know

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it's been uh i've kind of taken it from

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there and it's been it's been a lot of

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years of uh looking at spooky stories

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and having fun doing it

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that's right right right great stuff um

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now we are going to talk i'd like to

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talk a lot about the bridgewater

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triangle because that's such a

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fascinating area and so many things

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happening there in the huckabock swamp

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area and and all that and uh many many

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things not just ufos but

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as far as the i'm like a fan of history

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i'll put it that way and you know my

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my the business that i have is

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researching fine art and antiques that

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i've been doing all my life so it kind

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of goes hand hand and glove the the two

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things so i'm always fascinating and hit

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fascinated in history in american

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history especially and so i'd like to

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start out by talking about that in

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particular

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um

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you have searched researched way back

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are

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we talking colonial um encounters or

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anything is there anything that appears

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like it could have been an encounter in

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colonial times

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absolutely that's really how i kind of

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came to be focused on

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historical sightings because initially i

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was just interested in

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ufos in massachusetts in general

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but as i started to dig deeper and

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deeper into the past i kept finding

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examples of

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ufo sightings accounts from

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the early part of the 20th century from

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the 19th century the 18th century and

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even older than that

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that very much were you know the same as

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modern ufo sightings and to me that

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really captured my interest because um

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it seemed to me like it was kind of an

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important

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piece of information in terms of

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understanding this phenomenon if

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ufo sightings didn't really start in

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1947 if they didn't start in the space

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age or even in the 20th century

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if ufo sightings have kind of been a

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constant throughout all of

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human history

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that's important to know and i think

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that's an important clue so

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so yeah i documented or i guess other

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ufo investigators ufo historians had

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found this before i can't really take

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credit for it but

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i had written an article about a ufo

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sighting that took place

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in massachusetts in boston actually

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around 1638 or 1639

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this was a sighting where there were

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multiple witnesses they were in a boat

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they saw a great light that they

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described as being in the figure of a

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swine

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that seems to pull their boat back

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against the flow of the river

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and then when they arrived at their

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destination

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it was much later than they thought that

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it was going to be so you've got this

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this missing time case

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this physical effects case where the ufo

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seems to be drawing them backwards along

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the river plus you've got this

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description that it's the figure of a

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swine which sounds ridiculous but if we

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think about um maybe a lens shaped craft

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with four landing gear that might look

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like stubby pig legs right how would a

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person

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in 1639 describe this

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and so

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you know i had written an article about

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that that i had published on my own ufo

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website back in the 1990s and the old uh

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free website personal website days

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and that article got widely republished

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and picked up by some other

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larger websites and that kind of really

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uh

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sort of kick-started a lot of the

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historical stuff for me because i

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started to get uh information and

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contacts from other people who were

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looking at ufo sightings from hundreds

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of years ago and uh it's just

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unbelievable how rich this story is and

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how much information there really is out

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there about

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ufo sightings from hundreds of years ago

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and how similar they are to ufo

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sightings of today

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yeah i think that's all fascinating and

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i remember i had an astronomer on once

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and

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he talked about the odds of our life

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being

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kind of at the social level we're at

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and then another entity coming from

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somewhere else that happens to be alive

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at this present time the odds are he's

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the odds are even thinner i'm smaller

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because of you know we're just a little

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it's just a little tiny fraction of time

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like

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that we're at right now

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compared to what a civilization could

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have been developed you know

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uh with intelligent life

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uh millions of years ago you know so

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00:11:11,829 --> 00:11:10,079
that

279
00:11:13,509 --> 00:11:11,839
you know it brings up the the question

280
00:11:14,389 --> 00:11:13,519
of the ancient aliens you know i mean is

281
00:11:16,069 --> 00:11:14,399
that

282
00:11:18,630 --> 00:11:16,079
i think it's very possible we could have

283
00:11:20,790 --> 00:11:18,640
been visited all through our development

284
00:11:21,590 --> 00:11:20,800
possibly you know i know it's awful hard

285
00:11:24,470 --> 00:11:21,600
to

286
00:11:26,150 --> 00:11:24,480
you know look at anything as real

287
00:11:27,509 --> 00:11:26,160
evidence of that but you know that's

288
00:11:30,389 --> 00:11:27,519
possibilities

289
00:11:33,350 --> 00:11:30,399
and you know who knows i mean it's it's

290
00:11:35,430 --> 00:11:33,360
it's fascinating but uh i love these uh

291
00:11:38,069 --> 00:11:35,440
these old cases and

292
00:11:41,350 --> 00:11:38,079
i know that a lot of times when

293
00:11:43,269 --> 00:11:41,360
you you read about the early cases they

294
00:11:46,870 --> 00:11:43,279
are explaining what they're seeing in a

295
00:11:49,350 --> 00:11:46,880
fashion whether it's a um a shield in

296
00:11:51,990 --> 00:11:49,360
the sky and you know things like that

297
00:11:53,190 --> 00:11:52,000
because it's all they're using it and

298
00:11:54,790 --> 00:11:53,200
they're kind of

299
00:11:56,710 --> 00:11:54,800
you know it's a it's a thing that your

300
00:11:59,190 --> 00:11:56,720
your mind tends to do you try to make

301
00:12:00,470 --> 00:11:59,200
sense of what you're seeing and only you

302
00:12:02,629 --> 00:12:00,480
can only make sense of what you're

303
00:12:06,069 --> 00:12:02,639
seeing with things that you know about

304
00:12:07,590 --> 00:12:06,079
not something totally unusual like uh a

305
00:12:09,350 --> 00:12:07,600
disc you know they wouldn't they

306
00:12:10,550 --> 00:12:09,360
wouldn't know how to describe that

307
00:12:11,750 --> 00:12:10,560
but um

308
00:12:13,910 --> 00:12:11,760
yeah

309
00:12:15,509 --> 00:12:13,920
you know there's this phenomenon of uh

310
00:12:19,670 --> 00:12:15,519
cultural tracking

311
00:12:23,350 --> 00:12:19,680
where we see ufo sightings over time

312
00:12:25,110 --> 00:12:23,360
uh the the ufos are described in terms

313
00:12:27,350 --> 00:12:25,120
that are

314
00:12:29,190 --> 00:12:27,360
kind of unique to that culture that's

315
00:12:31,350 --> 00:12:29,200
describing it or is a form that they can

316
00:12:33,350 --> 00:12:31,360
relate to so

317
00:12:35,910 --> 00:12:33,360
back in the age of sale you've got these

318
00:12:38,069 --> 00:12:35,920
descriptions of flying ships dropping

319
00:12:40,069 --> 00:12:38,079
anchors and then in the last years of

320
00:12:43,269 --> 00:12:40,079
the 19th century the earliest years of

321
00:12:45,350 --> 00:12:43,279
the 20th century it's phantom airships

322
00:12:48,710 --> 00:12:45,360
and then in our space age it's

323
00:12:50,470 --> 00:12:48,720
spaceships um and there's of course

324
00:12:52,069 --> 00:12:50,480
multiple ways to look at that is the

325
00:12:54,550 --> 00:12:52,079
phenomenon

326
00:12:56,629 --> 00:12:54,560
is the intelligence behind ufos

327
00:12:58,710 --> 00:12:56,639
presenting itself to people in a form in

328
00:13:01,829 --> 00:12:58,720
which they can understand or is it just

329
00:13:03,509 --> 00:13:01,839
that people are describing these things

330
00:13:04,710 --> 00:13:03,519
based on their cultural framework i

331
00:13:06,949 --> 00:13:04,720
don't know if there's really any way to

332
00:13:08,389 --> 00:13:06,959
be sure about that

333
00:13:10,470 --> 00:13:08,399
right and that kind of goes along with

334
00:13:12,790 --> 00:13:10,480
the line also of

335
00:13:15,030 --> 00:13:12,800
one people like on the ariel school

336
00:13:17,750 --> 00:13:15,040
phenomenon had talked about they're

337
00:13:18,870 --> 00:13:17,760
getting like a message like a telepathy

338
00:13:21,110 --> 00:13:18,880
message

339
00:13:23,269 --> 00:13:21,120
and it always makes you think okay so

340
00:13:25,750 --> 00:13:23,279
how would they know the language of

341
00:13:28,150 --> 00:13:25,760
english or you know people in in russia

342
00:13:30,870 --> 00:13:28,160
when that they said that they heard

343
00:13:34,069 --> 00:13:30,880
messages in russian you know i mean

344
00:13:36,230 --> 00:13:34,079
it it's so so bizarre i mean uh to try

345
00:13:38,629 --> 00:13:36,240
to visualize all that

346
00:13:39,670 --> 00:13:38,639
and speaking of you know historical

347
00:13:41,110 --> 00:13:39,680
times

348
00:13:43,670 --> 00:13:41,120
uh

349
00:13:45,269 --> 00:13:43,680
what about abductions i mean has there

350
00:13:47,030 --> 00:13:45,279
was there anything that could have that

351
00:13:49,110 --> 00:13:47,040
you've ever read about that made it

352
00:13:52,389 --> 00:13:49,120
sound like it could have been

353
00:13:53,910 --> 00:13:52,399
like an abduction type of situation

354
00:13:55,829 --> 00:13:53,920
well you know it's interesting i i have

355
00:13:57,829 --> 00:13:55,839
a lot of experience with people who

356
00:13:59,990 --> 00:13:57,839
believe that they've been you know

357
00:14:03,590 --> 00:14:00,000
abducted by aliens or the term that that

358
00:14:04,629 --> 00:14:03,600
i came to use more often is experiencers

359
00:14:06,949 --> 00:14:04,639
and

360
00:14:09,110 --> 00:14:06,959
i participated in hypnosis regression

361
00:14:11,110 --> 00:14:09,120
sessions where we

362
00:14:13,509 --> 00:14:11,120
we hypnotized

363
00:14:15,910 --> 00:14:13,519
experiencers and and i watched them

364
00:14:18,550 --> 00:14:15,920
relive their experiences under hypnosis

365
00:14:22,230 --> 00:14:18,560
and it was extremely frightening

366
00:14:24,150 --> 00:14:22,240
i felt that what people told me

367
00:14:26,310 --> 00:14:24,160
without leading them

368
00:14:28,829 --> 00:14:26,320
differed in many ways in some ways

369
00:14:31,030 --> 00:14:28,839
anyway from kind of the mainstream

370
00:14:33,110 --> 00:14:31,040
narrative that i think a lot of people

371
00:14:35,990 --> 00:14:33,120
are familiar with from from best-selling

372
00:14:39,030 --> 00:14:36,000
books and from movies it was a lot

373
00:14:41,350 --> 00:14:39,040
stranger what they said it was

374
00:14:43,990 --> 00:14:41,360
it was not a straightforward narrative

375
00:14:44,790 --> 00:14:44,000
about people being snatched in the night

376
00:14:47,670 --> 00:14:44,800
and

377
00:14:49,430 --> 00:14:47,680
harvesting their genetic material it was

378
00:14:51,030 --> 00:14:49,440
there was aspect there were aspects of

379
00:14:52,870 --> 00:14:51,040
it that were almost spiritual or

380
00:14:54,629 --> 00:14:52,880
metaphysical really kind of difficult to

381
00:14:55,990 --> 00:14:54,639
describe

382
00:14:57,590 --> 00:14:56,000
but we see

383
00:15:00,230 --> 00:14:57,600
echoes of that

384
00:15:02,470 --> 00:15:00,240
in all of human history i mean religious

385
00:15:06,629 --> 00:15:02,480
texts are often

386
00:15:08,870 --> 00:15:06,639
full of encounters with aliens or demons

387
00:15:10,470 --> 00:15:08,880
that have extremely strong parallels to

388
00:15:13,430 --> 00:15:10,480
what people told me when they said that

389
00:15:15,110 --> 00:15:13,440
they had been on board a ufo

390
00:15:18,870 --> 00:15:15,120
and even the case that i just mentioned

391
00:15:20,790 --> 00:15:18,880
with its you know missing time attribute

392
00:15:22,949 --> 00:15:20,800
if we looked at that case in a 21st

393
00:15:25,430 --> 00:15:22,959
century framework i think we would

394
00:15:27,030 --> 00:15:25,440
certainly label that so-called abduction

395
00:15:29,430 --> 00:15:27,040
case um

396
00:15:31,990 --> 00:15:29,440
there's really no end to it because the

397
00:15:33,829 --> 00:15:32,000
the nature of these experiences where

398
00:15:35,030 --> 00:15:33,839
people said that they were on board the

399
00:15:37,509 --> 00:15:35,040
ufo

400
00:15:39,670 --> 00:15:37,519
they were so varied

401
00:15:40,870 --> 00:15:39,680
and so complex

402
00:15:43,749 --> 00:15:40,880
that

403
00:15:46,710 --> 00:15:43,759
you can find echoes of this in in many

404
00:15:50,230 --> 00:15:46,720
other aspects of human experience in

405
00:15:52,550 --> 00:15:50,240
spiritualism and seances

406
00:15:54,949 --> 00:15:52,560
so you almost have to draw arbitrary

407
00:15:56,870 --> 00:15:54,959
lines and say okay this this certainly

408
00:15:59,430 --> 00:15:56,880
couldn't be the same

409
00:16:01,910 --> 00:15:59,440
as a ufo abduction but this other story

410
00:16:03,829 --> 00:16:01,920
maybe it could be

411
00:16:06,069 --> 00:16:03,839
right right we have uh every once in a

412
00:16:07,990 --> 00:16:06,079
while i'll put up a questions in the

413
00:16:10,310 --> 00:16:08,000
chat and uh if you do want to ask a

414
00:16:11,910 --> 00:16:10,320
question please um and you're in chat

415
00:16:12,790 --> 00:16:11,920
please do make all caps so i don't miss

416
00:16:14,949 --> 00:16:12,800
them

417
00:16:17,670 --> 00:16:14,959
what case do you feel holds the most

418
00:16:20,470 --> 00:16:17,680
evidence or is the most compelling that

419
00:16:21,430 --> 00:16:20,480
you've come across in your research

420
00:16:24,150 --> 00:16:21,440
well

421
00:16:27,189 --> 00:16:24,160
look there's no proof of really anything

422
00:16:28,310 --> 00:16:27,199
that i'm talking about here if ufos were

423
00:16:31,030 --> 00:16:28,320
proven

424
00:16:32,069 --> 00:16:31,040
if there was proof for what i'm saying

425
00:16:33,749 --> 00:16:32,079
um

426
00:16:36,230 --> 00:16:33,759
we wouldn't call them ufos right it

427
00:16:39,990 --> 00:16:36,240
wouldn't be unidentified the whole the

428
00:16:42,310 --> 00:16:40,000
whole subject is couched in this

429
00:16:45,350 --> 00:16:42,320
in this kind of twilight where it is a

430
00:16:46,069 --> 00:16:45,360
mystery it really remains a mystery

431
00:16:47,670 --> 00:16:46,079
so

432
00:16:50,629 --> 00:16:47,680
just to get out get that out there that

433
00:16:53,030 --> 00:16:50,639
there's there is no proof there is tons

434
00:16:56,150 --> 00:16:53,040
and tons and tons of evidence this

435
00:16:58,230 --> 00:16:56,160
tremendous body of evidence uh most of

436
00:16:59,509 --> 00:16:58,240
it you know in in recent decades but

437
00:17:01,110 --> 00:16:59,519
stuff that goes back hundreds and

438
00:17:04,549 --> 00:17:01,120
hundreds of years

439
00:17:07,110 --> 00:17:04,559
if i had to point at one story that to

440
00:17:09,029 --> 00:17:07,120
me is the most compelling now i

441
00:17:10,150 --> 00:17:09,039
understand this that this isn't a proven

442
00:17:12,549 --> 00:17:10,160
thing so

443
00:17:14,390 --> 00:17:12,559
some people may scoff at this

444
00:17:17,990 --> 00:17:14,400
but i think it it's the paul trent

445
00:17:18,870 --> 00:17:18,000
photos from mcmanville oregon in 1950.

446
00:17:19,829 --> 00:17:18,880
this

447
00:17:21,909 --> 00:17:19,839
farmer

448
00:17:24,549 --> 00:17:21,919
in oregon

449
00:17:27,189 --> 00:17:24,559
in a rural area long ago

450
00:17:28,230 --> 00:17:27,199
took a photograph of something that is

451
00:17:31,110 --> 00:17:28,240
either

452
00:17:33,909 --> 00:17:31,120
a structured craft in the sky

453
00:17:36,230 --> 00:17:33,919
or it's it's a fake he either faked it

454
00:17:38,789 --> 00:17:36,240
or it's a ufo there's no way that the

455
00:17:43,029 --> 00:17:38,799
object in these photographs could be

456
00:17:45,190 --> 00:17:43,039
um a bird or the planet venus or an

457
00:17:48,310 --> 00:17:45,200
airplane or anything else that you might

458
00:17:49,430 --> 00:17:48,320
mistake for a spaceship in the sky

459
00:17:51,350 --> 00:17:49,440
and

460
00:17:53,830 --> 00:17:51,360
he took the photos

461
00:17:56,230 --> 00:17:53,840
he showed them to some local people

462
00:17:59,190 --> 00:17:56,240
but he wasn't even like motivated really

463
00:18:01,830 --> 00:17:59,200
to publish these photos a newspaper

464
00:18:03,190 --> 00:18:01,840
reporter heard about the photos came to

465
00:18:05,750 --> 00:18:03,200
his house

466
00:18:08,390 --> 00:18:05,760
looked at the photos and said uh where

467
00:18:10,470 --> 00:18:08,400
are the negatives and at that moment

468
00:18:13,430 --> 00:18:10,480
their child was playing with the

469
00:18:15,270 --> 00:18:13,440
negatives sitting under a desk it wasn't

470
00:18:16,390 --> 00:18:15,280
something that they deemed yeah there's

471
00:18:17,590 --> 00:18:16,400
the photo

472
00:18:18,630 --> 00:18:17,600
um

473
00:18:21,350 --> 00:18:18,640
and

474
00:18:24,230 --> 00:18:21,360
you know they're as far to my knowledge

475
00:18:26,470 --> 00:18:24,240
there has never been any analysis of

476
00:18:28,710 --> 00:18:26,480
this photograph i i think the original

477
00:18:30,630 --> 00:18:28,720
negatives are now missing so it limits

478
00:18:32,630 --> 00:18:30,640
what analysis can be done but there's

479
00:18:33,990 --> 00:18:32,640
never been any analysis of this

480
00:18:35,830 --> 00:18:34,000
photograph

481
00:18:38,390 --> 00:18:35,840
that has um

482
00:18:40,950 --> 00:18:38,400
shown it to be some kind of a fake and

483
00:18:42,950 --> 00:18:40,960
paul trent the photographer went to his

484
00:18:45,190 --> 00:18:42,960
grave saying that it was real and that

485
00:18:47,990 --> 00:18:45,200
it wasn't a fake so this is kind of

486
00:18:49,830 --> 00:18:48,000
where we're at with ufos you know if

487
00:18:52,549 --> 00:18:49,840
there's going to you know what what even

488
00:18:55,190 --> 00:18:52,559
could be proof do they have to land and

489
00:18:58,310 --> 00:18:55,200
and talk to newspaper reporters if there

490
00:18:59,990 --> 00:18:58,320
are photographs of structured craft in

491
00:19:02,310 --> 00:19:00,000
our atmosphere

492
00:19:04,630 --> 00:19:02,320
that are not anything made by a person

493
00:19:06,390 --> 00:19:04,640
or not anything that we can understand

494
00:19:08,710 --> 00:19:06,400
i mean that's then that then they're

495
00:19:10,950 --> 00:19:08,720
real right and that's kind of what the

496
00:19:15,270 --> 00:19:10,960
mcmanville photograph means to me if

497
00:19:17,669 --> 00:19:15,280
that photo is real then ufos are real

498
00:19:18,950 --> 00:19:17,679
yeah yep i mean like you said it only

499
00:19:20,630 --> 00:19:18,960
takes one

500
00:19:23,029 --> 00:19:20,640
you know one real

501
00:19:25,990 --> 00:19:23,039
ufo and what what will it take i mean

502
00:19:29,750 --> 00:19:26,000
how how would you think the world

503
00:19:31,510 --> 00:19:29,760
like if say for instance all of a sudden

504
00:19:34,470 --> 00:19:31,520
there was this great sighting there was

505
00:19:36,789 --> 00:19:34,480
multiple witnesses and great video and

506
00:19:39,430 --> 00:19:36,799
photos do you still think that

507
00:19:41,590 --> 00:19:39,440
um and and the government actually came

508
00:19:42,710 --> 00:19:41,600
forward and said or whatever part of the

509
00:19:45,029 --> 00:19:42,720
government

510
00:19:45,909 --> 00:19:45,039
would say we have no idea what this is

511
00:19:47,830 --> 00:19:45,919
um

512
00:19:49,830 --> 00:19:47,840
how many people would did you think it

513
00:19:51,909 --> 00:19:49,840
would just be exactly the same

514
00:19:54,390 --> 00:19:51,919
what what do you think would be the

515
00:19:57,110 --> 00:19:54,400
proof that we would need before

516
00:19:58,310 --> 00:19:57,120
most of society would buy that

517
00:20:00,230 --> 00:19:58,320
this is

518
00:20:02,630 --> 00:20:00,240
otherworldly

519
00:20:05,270 --> 00:20:02,640
it would almost have to be like you know

520
00:20:07,510 --> 00:20:05,280
every city in the world had ufos

521
00:20:09,669 --> 00:20:07,520
hovering in the sky that people could

522
00:20:12,470 --> 00:20:09,679
see i mean if i'll be honest with you if

523
00:20:15,190 --> 00:20:12,480
our government came forward and said

524
00:20:16,630 --> 00:20:15,200
all right we've got proof of ufos and we

525
00:20:18,950 --> 00:20:16,640
don't know what they are you know kind

526
00:20:20,549 --> 00:20:18,960
of along the lines of what has been

527
00:20:22,789 --> 00:20:20,559
coming out lately

528
00:20:25,270 --> 00:20:22,799
um i'm still distrustful of that i'm

529
00:20:27,350 --> 00:20:25,280
just trustful of our government i

530
00:20:29,990 --> 00:20:27,360
understand that our government will use

531
00:20:31,270 --> 00:20:30,000
ufo hype as cover for their secret

532
00:20:32,870 --> 00:20:31,280
projects

533
00:20:34,789 --> 00:20:32,880
and so

534
00:20:35,830 --> 00:20:34,799
you know i i don't even know what would

535
00:20:37,750 --> 00:20:35,840
like

536
00:20:39,590 --> 00:20:37,760
i'm convinced that ufos are real because

537
00:20:40,789 --> 00:20:39,600
of my own personal experiences because

538
00:20:43,110 --> 00:20:40,799
of what i

539
00:20:44,950 --> 00:20:43,120
learned doing the investigations because

540
00:20:47,110 --> 00:20:44,960
of things that happened to me because of

541
00:20:50,789 --> 00:20:47,120
witnesses who i talked to so many of

542
00:20:52,950 --> 00:20:50,799
whom seemed so absolutely sincere and if

543
00:20:55,590 --> 00:20:52,960
even one of those people was telling the

544
00:20:57,990 --> 00:20:55,600
truth then that means that somebody had

545
00:21:01,830 --> 00:20:58,000
an encounter with some non-human

546
00:21:05,190 --> 00:21:01,840
intelligence that we can't explain

547
00:21:07,750 --> 00:21:05,200
that's proof enough for me but

548
00:21:09,669 --> 00:21:07,760
and i do think that society in general

549
00:21:13,510 --> 00:21:09,679
is becoming more accepting of the fact

550
00:21:15,430 --> 00:21:13,520
that ufos represent a reality um

551
00:21:17,669 --> 00:21:15,440
especially like i alluded to earlier

552
00:21:18,710 --> 00:21:17,679
with the kind of disclosures or whatever

553
00:21:20,710 --> 00:21:18,720
you want to call them that have been

554
00:21:22,630 --> 00:21:20,720
coming out but there are always going to

555
00:21:24,390 --> 00:21:22,640
be people that say well absolutely no

556
00:21:25,590 --> 00:21:24,400
way and i don't think that's ever going

557
00:21:28,390 --> 00:21:25,600
to change

558
00:21:30,149 --> 00:21:28,400
yeah i i just heard

559
00:21:31,510 --> 00:21:30,159
neil degrasse tyson again on another

560
00:21:33,350 --> 00:21:31,520
interview and

561
00:21:35,110 --> 00:21:33,360
wailing away how it has to be you know

562
00:21:37,669 --> 00:21:35,120
software glitches and things like that

563
00:21:39,510 --> 00:21:37,679
and uh there's there's always gonna be

564
00:21:43,669 --> 00:21:39,520
those people there have you yourself

565
00:21:47,110 --> 00:21:43,679
ever had any any type of ufo sighting

566
00:21:48,070 --> 00:21:47,120
that's a tough question for me to answer

567
00:21:51,110 --> 00:21:48,080
um

568
00:21:52,950 --> 00:21:51,120
when i was a ufo investigator

569
00:21:54,630 --> 00:21:52,960
actively

570
00:21:56,950 --> 00:21:54,640
rather than kind of where i'm at now

571
00:21:58,870 --> 00:21:56,960
which is mostly looking at it almost as

572
00:22:00,630 --> 00:21:58,880
a folklore perspective and collecting

573
00:22:02,390 --> 00:22:00,640
stories and legends

574
00:22:04,870 --> 00:22:02,400
um i had a lot of really weird things

575
00:22:06,070 --> 00:22:04,880
happen to me all the time very many

576
00:22:07,990 --> 00:22:06,080
and

577
00:22:09,909 --> 00:22:08,000
some of those things were

578
00:22:11,029 --> 00:22:09,919
seeing lights in the sky

579
00:22:14,310 --> 00:22:11,039
um

580
00:22:16,070 --> 00:22:14,320
sometimes it even got to the point where

581
00:22:17,590 --> 00:22:16,080
i felt like i could predict where these

582
00:22:19,110 --> 00:22:17,600
things were going to appear and then i

583
00:22:21,990 --> 00:22:19,120
could see them

584
00:22:23,029 --> 00:22:22,000
i know it sounds crazy it was really a

585
00:22:24,630 --> 00:22:23,039
strange

586
00:22:27,510 --> 00:22:24,640
time it was a

587
00:22:29,750 --> 00:22:27,520
very frightening experience but the

588
00:22:32,149 --> 00:22:29,760
thing is is that when i was a ufo

589
00:22:34,789 --> 00:22:32,159
investigator if people came to me and

590
00:22:36,549 --> 00:22:34,799
said well i saw a light in the sky

591
00:22:38,630 --> 00:22:36,559
and i don't think it was an airplane i

592
00:22:39,590 --> 00:22:38,640
saw it at night and it moved in a way

593
00:22:41,350 --> 00:22:39,600
that

594
00:22:43,270 --> 00:22:41,360
seemed really strange to me or it

595
00:22:45,590 --> 00:22:43,280
suddenly appeared or

596
00:22:47,909 --> 00:22:45,600
suddenly vanished i didn't investigate

597
00:22:50,230 --> 00:22:47,919
those kind of cases because there are so

598
00:22:53,110 --> 00:22:50,240
many things in the night sky that can

599
00:22:55,110 --> 00:22:53,120
appear as a point source of light

600
00:22:57,350 --> 00:22:55,120
yeah there's so many things that can be

601
00:22:59,430 --> 00:22:57,360
confusing or surprising if you really

602
00:23:01,669 --> 00:22:59,440
look at the night sky

603
00:23:03,270 --> 00:23:01,679
that i didn't feel like those things

604
00:23:06,149 --> 00:23:03,280
really could be

605
00:23:09,830 --> 00:23:06,159
um put in one category or another as

606
00:23:12,390 --> 00:23:09,840
strange as a report of a of a light in

607
00:23:14,789 --> 00:23:12,400
the night might have sounded

608
00:23:16,870 --> 00:23:14,799
i didn't feel like there was a way to

609
00:23:19,909 --> 00:23:16,880
absolutely rule out the possibility that

610
00:23:21,510 --> 00:23:19,919
it was a helicopter or a lantern that

611
00:23:24,950 --> 00:23:21,520
someone had settled off or something

612
00:23:26,310 --> 00:23:24,960
like that i was interested in

613
00:23:28,230 --> 00:23:26,320
investigating

614
00:23:30,870 --> 00:23:28,240
sightings of structured craft

615
00:23:33,190 --> 00:23:30,880
particularly made during the day and i

616
00:23:35,510 --> 00:23:33,200
never had any ufo sighting like that i

617
00:23:37,590 --> 00:23:35,520
never saw anything like that myself

618
00:23:40,390 --> 00:23:37,600
but i did have i would say almost

619
00:23:42,310 --> 00:23:40,400
countless experiences during the time

620
00:23:44,710 --> 00:23:42,320
that i was going out and investigating

621
00:23:47,350 --> 00:23:44,720
ufo sightings i would go to places where

622
00:23:49,510 --> 00:23:47,360
ufos had just recently been seen and i

623
00:23:51,590 --> 00:23:49,520
would be watching the skies and i saw

624
00:23:53,830 --> 00:23:51,600
things there i saw things that despite

625
00:23:56,149 --> 00:23:53,840
all my training as a ufo investigator

626
00:23:57,990 --> 00:23:56,159
despite my understanding of how things

627
00:23:59,029 --> 00:23:58,000
look in the sky i couldn't explain those

628
00:23:59,990 --> 00:23:59,039
things

629
00:24:01,590 --> 00:24:00,000
um

630
00:24:04,149 --> 00:24:01,600
but it's like i say it's very

631
00:24:06,710 --> 00:24:04,159
tantalizing again it becomes a matter of

632
00:24:08,310 --> 00:24:06,720
of evidence but not proof you know it's

633
00:24:11,029 --> 00:24:08,320
so tantalizing

634
00:24:12,870 --> 00:24:11,039
right right i had uh

635
00:24:14,630 --> 00:24:12,880
a sighting is how i got interested in

636
00:24:18,149 --> 00:24:14,640
you know this this topic and doing the

637
00:24:19,909 --> 00:24:18,159
show but uh back in september 24th i i

638
00:24:21,830 --> 00:24:19,919
filmed something as i was coming back

639
00:24:23,830 --> 00:24:21,840
from restaurant i'm pretty sure it's a

640
00:24:25,750 --> 00:24:23,840
drone and i showed this on one of my

641
00:24:44,310 --> 00:24:25,760
shows before but why not show it now i'm

642
00:24:44,320 --> 00:24:48,390
actually filming

643
00:24:53,269 --> 00:24:51,110
that's a light reflect a reflection

644
00:25:01,190 --> 00:24:53,279
lens reflection or whatever but that's

645
00:25:04,549 --> 00:25:03,190
jeez

646
00:25:06,789 --> 00:25:04,559
this is

647
00:25:08,710 --> 00:25:06,799
unbelievable

648
00:25:10,070 --> 00:25:08,720
those little things moving around that's

649
00:25:12,230 --> 00:25:10,080
just the

650
00:25:15,029 --> 00:25:12,240
street lights and the lens

651
00:25:22,070 --> 00:25:15,039
but this red thing which turns white is

652
00:25:26,549 --> 00:25:23,990
well it's it's a lot longer than that

653
00:25:28,549 --> 00:25:26,559
but that's that's just a little clip

654
00:25:29,909 --> 00:25:28,559
of it and pretty much

655
00:25:32,870 --> 00:25:29,919
i'm pretty much thinking that was

656
00:25:36,390 --> 00:25:32,880
probably a drone but it was very windy

657
00:25:38,070 --> 00:25:36,400
that night and uh i never saw where it

658
00:25:38,870 --> 00:25:38,080
landed i ran over to where it should

659
00:25:41,669 --> 00:25:38,880
have

660
00:25:42,950 --> 00:25:41,679
anyway

661
00:25:44,630 --> 00:25:42,960
so when you see something like that

662
00:25:46,070 --> 00:25:44,640
that's just another light in the sky

663
00:25:49,669 --> 00:25:46,080
right

664
00:25:52,149 --> 00:25:49,679
well we don't know what kind of aircraft

665
00:25:54,789 --> 00:25:52,159
our military are flying right now you

666
00:25:57,750 --> 00:25:54,799
know they have a tremendous black budget

667
00:25:59,830 --> 00:25:57,760
we know that they have secret projects

668
00:26:03,830 --> 00:25:59,840
that that we don't know about there

669
00:26:05,750 --> 00:26:03,840
hasn't been a major disclosure of a new

670
00:26:07,909 --> 00:26:05,760
aircraft technology

671
00:26:09,909 --> 00:26:07,919
from the military in a long time but we

672
00:26:11,830 --> 00:26:09,919
know that their technology has advanced

673
00:26:13,990 --> 00:26:11,840
past that point so

674
00:26:16,710 --> 00:26:14,000
that really kind of muddies the waters i

675
00:26:20,310 --> 00:26:16,720
think nowadays especially of

676
00:26:21,269 --> 00:26:20,320
ufo research we just there's technology

677
00:26:23,190 --> 00:26:21,279
that

678
00:26:24,549 --> 00:26:23,200
we know about but aren't familiar with

679
00:26:27,029 --> 00:26:24,559
and there's technology that we don't

680
00:26:28,310 --> 00:26:27,039
even know about um so to try to

681
00:26:31,350 --> 00:26:28,320
determine

682
00:26:34,710 --> 00:26:31,360
uh okay this represents an encounter of

683
00:26:36,710 --> 00:26:34,720
with a non-human intelligence versus

684
00:26:38,870 --> 00:26:36,720
uh this represents an encounter with

685
00:26:41,350 --> 00:26:38,880
unfamiliar unknown human technology it

686
00:26:42,630 --> 00:26:41,360
becomes a real challenge

687
00:26:44,310 --> 00:26:42,640
right there's a

688
00:26:46,549 --> 00:26:44,320
someone asked me the other day and i i

689
00:26:49,350 --> 00:26:46,559
had always heard that it was

690
00:26:52,149 --> 00:26:49,360
unfounded about the tr-3b

691
00:26:53,510 --> 00:26:52,159
do you know anything that that that was

692
00:26:55,669 --> 00:26:53,520
never something that never really

693
00:26:57,350 --> 00:26:55,679
existed is that do you know anything

694
00:26:59,190 --> 00:26:57,360
about that by chance i don't know i

695
00:27:01,110 --> 00:26:59,200
don't know if it existed or not i mean

696
00:27:04,390 --> 00:27:01,120
we've had um

697
00:27:07,350 --> 00:27:04,400
over the last 20 30 years

698
00:27:10,149 --> 00:27:07,360
uh countless stories about project

699
00:27:11,510 --> 00:27:10,159
aurora and all of these other uh kind of

700
00:27:14,470 --> 00:27:11,520
hinted at

701
00:27:15,350 --> 00:27:14,480
secret projects black budget stuff but

702
00:27:17,269 --> 00:27:15,360
um

703
00:27:18,789 --> 00:27:17,279
i think there's still just a lot of

704
00:27:20,950 --> 00:27:18,799
question marks about this stuff and

705
00:27:22,870 --> 00:27:20,960
frankly i do believe that our government

706
00:27:26,389 --> 00:27:22,880
does take advantage of

707
00:27:28,389 --> 00:27:26,399
ufo hype in order to yeah give them some

708
00:27:31,269 --> 00:27:28,399
cover for testing these things

709
00:27:33,029 --> 00:27:31,279
i i agree with that and you know you

710
00:27:35,029 --> 00:27:33,039
hear you know we talked

711
00:27:35,909 --> 00:27:35,039
earlier about mcminnville

712
00:27:37,750 --> 00:27:35,919
and

713
00:27:41,669 --> 00:27:37,760
you know it seems like the flavor of the

714
00:27:43,190 --> 00:27:41,679
day is triangles now and you know i've

715
00:27:46,070 --> 00:27:43,200
had people on the show that think every

716
00:27:48,950 --> 00:27:46,080
single triangle is a black project you

717
00:27:50,230 --> 00:27:48,960
know being tested or whatever but um but

718
00:27:53,669 --> 00:27:50,240
it doesn't account for the ones that

719
00:27:55,350 --> 00:27:53,679
happened back in the 1970s you know 1978

720
00:27:58,230 --> 00:27:55,360
there was you know quite a triangle

721
00:28:00,549 --> 00:27:58,240
sighting uh lee spiegel had an encounter

722
00:28:01,669 --> 00:28:00,559
you know around that time as well

723
00:28:03,830 --> 00:28:01,679
and so

724
00:28:05,830 --> 00:28:03,840
the the thing that i always like to

725
00:28:07,909 --> 00:28:05,840
argue is okay so we do have these

726
00:28:11,029 --> 00:28:07,919
anti-gravity let's just say we do

727
00:28:13,590 --> 00:28:11,039
anti-gravity triangles uh and we've had

728
00:28:15,350 --> 00:28:13,600
them since the 1970s wouldn't that be

729
00:28:17,510 --> 00:28:15,360
such an advantage over other countries

730
00:28:19,909 --> 00:28:17,520
why wouldn't we be using that and say

731
00:28:21,029 --> 00:28:19,919
warfare or something like that

732
00:28:23,430 --> 00:28:21,039
i mean have you ever thought about all

733
00:28:25,110 --> 00:28:23,440
that stuff we we could be using them in

734
00:28:27,909 --> 00:28:25,120
warfare and i think we wouldn't

735
00:28:29,269 --> 00:28:27,919
necessarily know about it i mean

736
00:28:32,070 --> 00:28:29,279
we've seen

737
00:28:33,430 --> 00:28:32,080
through some leaks that have come out

738
00:28:36,310 --> 00:28:33,440
um

739
00:28:37,909 --> 00:28:36,320
stuff that's happened in our wars

740
00:28:39,990 --> 00:28:37,919
that um

741
00:28:42,149 --> 00:28:40,000
you know was not supposed to be how it

742
00:28:43,590 --> 00:28:42,159
was i mean and there basically there are

743
00:28:45,350 --> 00:28:43,600
secrets that have been revealed and i

744
00:28:47,350 --> 00:28:45,360
think there are secrets that haven't

745
00:28:49,269 --> 00:28:47,360
been revealed the point that you're

746
00:28:53,350 --> 00:28:49,279
making about the shift towards

747
00:28:55,510 --> 00:28:53,360
triangular craft is definitely real um

748
00:28:59,110 --> 00:28:55,520
even in the 1990s

749
00:29:01,590 --> 00:28:59,120
um relatively few people were telling me

750
00:29:03,190 --> 00:29:01,600
that they saw a disc shaped craft i

751
00:29:05,190 --> 00:29:03,200
talked to a lot of people including

752
00:29:08,070 --> 00:29:05,200
military pilots other trained witnesses

753
00:29:10,389 --> 00:29:08,080
who saw the triangles um of course there

754
00:29:12,389 --> 00:29:10,399
are reports of triangular craft that go

755
00:29:15,029 --> 00:29:12,399
back for a long time but i think any

756
00:29:17,990 --> 00:29:15,039
explanation of what ufos are and

757
00:29:21,110 --> 00:29:18,000
represent needs to explain why in the

758
00:29:22,789 --> 00:29:21,120
1950s and 60s the disc shape was so

759
00:29:25,590 --> 00:29:22,799
predominant and then

760
00:29:27,830 --> 00:29:25,600
in the 1970s and especially in the 80s

761
00:29:30,070 --> 00:29:27,840
and the 90s the triangles became

762
00:29:33,029 --> 00:29:30,080
predominant to the point that today

763
00:29:35,830 --> 00:29:33,039
i think uh triangles are are really

764
00:29:41,430 --> 00:29:39,190
i think that any explanation of ufo

765
00:29:43,669 --> 00:29:41,440
sightings has to take into account other

766
00:29:46,230 --> 00:29:43,679
ways that this phenomenon has changed

767
00:29:48,389 --> 00:29:46,240
over time as well

768
00:29:49,990 --> 00:29:48,399
the reports that i see

769
00:29:52,310 --> 00:29:50,000
now or that people

770
00:29:54,310 --> 00:29:52,320
tell me about of sightings that were

771
00:29:56,630 --> 00:29:54,320
relatively recent they're they're

772
00:30:00,149 --> 00:29:56,640
different even from the 1990s sightings

773
00:30:03,350 --> 00:30:00,159
you know in the 90s i was investigating

774
00:30:06,870 --> 00:30:03,360
landing cases i was investigating a lot

775
00:30:09,350 --> 00:30:06,880
of daylight structured craft cases um

776
00:30:10,230 --> 00:30:09,360
and we used to talk about how oh man if

777
00:30:11,669 --> 00:30:10,240
only

778
00:30:13,430 --> 00:30:11,679
there was some way that we could put a

779
00:30:15,510 --> 00:30:13,440
phone a camera right if we could put a

780
00:30:16,950 --> 00:30:15,520
camera in everybody's pocket then we

781
00:30:18,549 --> 00:30:16,960
maybe we would have so much better

782
00:30:19,430 --> 00:30:18,559
evidence maybe we would finally have

783
00:30:21,350 --> 00:30:19,440
proof

784
00:30:23,750 --> 00:30:21,360
well now here we are

785
00:30:25,990 --> 00:30:23,760
decades later and everybody does have a

786
00:30:28,549 --> 00:30:26,000
camera in their pocket and sure there's

787
00:30:32,070 --> 00:30:28,559
new ufo photos and video that come out

788
00:30:33,269 --> 00:30:32,080
all the time but but it's not like the

789
00:30:34,870 --> 00:30:33,279
for the most part it's not like the

790
00:30:36,470 --> 00:30:34,880
structured craft sightings that i used

791
00:30:38,149 --> 00:30:36,480
to investigate it's certainly not the

792
00:30:40,789 --> 00:30:38,159
landing type stuff

793
00:30:43,430 --> 00:30:40,799
um so why did that change you know it

794
00:30:45,510 --> 00:30:43,440
that's a question that that i ask myself

795
00:30:48,389 --> 00:30:45,520
a lot

796
00:30:52,310 --> 00:30:48,399
yeah yeah well for for the record what i

797
00:30:55,029 --> 00:30:52,320
saw was a a perfect disc shape in

798
00:30:58,070 --> 00:30:55,039
2007. i mean it looked exactly like the

799
00:30:59,669 --> 00:30:58,080
old the old-fashioned flying saucers

800
00:31:00,950 --> 00:30:59,679
maybe because i'm an antiques guy i

801
00:31:02,710 --> 00:31:00,960
don't know but

802
00:31:04,710 --> 00:31:02,720
anyway that's what i saw here's a

803
00:31:07,430 --> 00:31:04,720
question that just popped up uh what do

804
00:31:10,549 --> 00:31:07,440
you think they're here for i i always

805
00:31:12,710 --> 00:31:10,559
like that question and well

806
00:31:15,190 --> 00:31:12,720
look the thing the thing about this is

807
00:31:16,630 --> 00:31:15,200
is that um

808
00:31:19,750 --> 00:31:16,640
this is a really difficult question for

809
00:31:21,669 --> 00:31:19,760
me to answer and

810
00:31:23,350 --> 00:31:21,679
there's not an easy way for me to say

811
00:31:24,870 --> 00:31:23,360
this and there's not a way for me to say

812
00:31:25,830 --> 00:31:24,880
this that's going to come across as

813
00:31:27,590 --> 00:31:25,840
being

814
00:31:29,990 --> 00:31:27,600
convincing but i'm going to give you the

815
00:31:32,470 --> 00:31:30,000
honest conclusion that i came up with

816
00:31:33,509 --> 00:31:32,480
after years of investigating ufo

817
00:31:35,430 --> 00:31:33,519
sightings

818
00:31:37,029 --> 00:31:35,440
i came to the conclusion that these

819
00:31:39,110 --> 00:31:37,039
sightings represent encounters with a

820
00:31:40,389 --> 00:31:39,120
non-human intelligence that's based on

821
00:31:42,870 --> 00:31:40,399
this planet

822
00:31:45,909 --> 00:31:42,880
i didn't come up with evidence

823
00:31:48,549 --> 00:31:45,919
that suggested that ufos were from space

824
00:31:50,870 --> 00:31:48,559
the evidence that i was confronted with

825
00:31:52,470 --> 00:31:50,880
suggested that they are from here

826
00:31:53,430 --> 00:31:52,480
and so

827
00:31:55,110 --> 00:31:53,440
um

828
00:31:56,789 --> 00:31:55,120
not only do i believe that they're from

829
00:31:58,310 --> 00:31:56,799
here but i believe that they basically

830
00:32:00,149 --> 00:31:58,320
have always been here that they have

831
00:32:01,029 --> 00:32:00,159
been here for as long as we have been

832
00:32:02,230 --> 00:32:01,039
here

833
00:32:03,669 --> 00:32:02,240
um

834
00:32:05,190 --> 00:32:03,679
and

835
00:32:07,669 --> 00:32:05,200
i think that they

836
00:32:10,070 --> 00:32:07,679
interact with human beings

837
00:32:12,230 --> 00:32:10,080
in a deliberate way i think that what

838
00:32:15,190 --> 00:32:12,240
what we might perceive as a bunch of

839
00:32:16,310 --> 00:32:15,200
random chance encounters

840
00:32:18,070 --> 00:32:16,320
actually

841
00:32:21,430 --> 00:32:18,080
is part of a strategy that they have

842
00:32:23,590 --> 00:32:21,440
it's part of a deliberate plan that we

843
00:32:25,110 --> 00:32:23,600
can't really understand that maybe we

844
00:32:27,430 --> 00:32:25,120
aren't equipped to understand or that we

845
00:32:28,310 --> 00:32:27,440
can only guess that but i think that

846
00:32:32,230 --> 00:32:28,320
their

847
00:32:35,590 --> 00:32:32,240
interactions with us is all a part of a

848
00:32:37,190 --> 00:32:35,600
deliberate design and that um i think

849
00:32:39,750 --> 00:32:37,200
that it is negative

850
00:32:42,310 --> 00:32:39,760
for human beings and um so there are

851
00:32:44,950 --> 00:32:42,320
people in this field that i respect

852
00:32:46,710 --> 00:32:44,960
tremendously who totally disagree with

853
00:32:49,590 --> 00:32:46,720
me and there are people who've had

854
00:32:51,269 --> 00:32:49,600
personal experiences that i really

855
00:32:53,350 --> 00:32:51,279
believe and that i i think that they

856
00:32:56,389 --> 00:32:53,360
have insight into this and they believe

857
00:32:58,470 --> 00:32:56,399
that this is a positive thing for people

858
00:33:00,870 --> 00:32:58,480
but that's not what that's not what i

859
00:33:04,470 --> 00:33:00,880
found and that's not where the evidence

860
00:33:05,750 --> 00:33:04,480
eventually led me so um i think that ufo

861
00:33:07,350 --> 00:33:05,760
settings represent a non-human

862
00:33:08,950 --> 00:33:07,360
intelligence based on this planet and i

863
00:33:11,590 --> 00:33:08,960
think that they that they want to

864
00:33:13,909 --> 00:33:11,600
control us and i think that they want to

865
00:33:15,990 --> 00:33:13,919
affect us in a negative way as crazy as

866
00:33:18,070 --> 00:33:16,000
that sounds i i know well i don't i

867
00:33:21,190 --> 00:33:18,080
don't think it's absolutely crazy and

868
00:33:22,549 --> 00:33:21,200
i'm gonna tell you why um that i don't

869
00:33:24,389 --> 00:33:22,559
think it's crazy

870
00:33:26,389 --> 00:33:24,399
i just listened to

871
00:33:27,909 --> 00:33:26,399
the theory of everything as a youtube

872
00:33:29,669 --> 00:33:27,919
channel with kurt

873
00:33:32,149 --> 00:33:29,679
i i can't pronounce his last name and by

874
00:33:34,630 --> 00:33:32,159
the way he'll be on this show sometime

875
00:33:37,110 --> 00:33:34,640
next year kurt will be but um he

876
00:33:39,909 --> 00:33:37,120
interviewed lou elizondo

877
00:33:41,669 --> 00:33:39,919
and um it was a great interview i one of

878
00:33:43,509 --> 00:33:41,679
the best interviews i've heard of

879
00:33:44,630 --> 00:33:43,519
louel's hondo and there's a part in

880
00:33:45,750 --> 00:33:44,640
there

881
00:33:48,950 --> 00:33:45,760
where

882
00:33:50,630 --> 00:33:48,960
lou brings up uh what if

883
00:33:52,310 --> 00:33:50,640
uh we've always thought that we're the

884
00:33:55,029 --> 00:33:52,320
top of the food chain the smartest

885
00:33:57,029 --> 00:33:55,039
beings on the earth but what if the

886
00:33:59,110 --> 00:33:57,039
reality is that

887
00:34:00,950 --> 00:33:59,120
was not true

888
00:34:03,750 --> 00:34:00,960
and the way he puts it he's going to be

889
00:34:05,750 --> 00:34:03,760
on next month on this show and i'm going

890
00:34:07,110 --> 00:34:05,760
to get him to expand into that but he

891
00:34:09,190 --> 00:34:07,120
was kind of

892
00:34:11,349 --> 00:34:09,200
leading along the lines of what you're

893
00:34:14,470 --> 00:34:11,359
talking about so i find this really

894
00:34:16,629 --> 00:34:14,480
fascinating um he didn't go into much

895
00:34:19,349 --> 00:34:16,639
detail but what he kind of posed the

896
00:34:21,190 --> 00:34:19,359
question what if we find out

897
00:34:23,669 --> 00:34:21,200
that we are not

898
00:34:26,550 --> 00:34:23,679
the highest thing on the food chain

899
00:34:27,750 --> 00:34:26,560
so to speak um so i think it's an

900
00:34:29,030 --> 00:34:27,760
interesting i don't think it's

901
00:34:31,349 --> 00:34:29,040
outlandish

902
00:34:33,030 --> 00:34:31,359
i think um and and i like to have

903
00:34:35,270 --> 00:34:33,040
i like to pose

904
00:34:36,950 --> 00:34:35,280
or hear that question

905
00:34:39,270 --> 00:34:36,960
because it's really

906
00:34:41,349 --> 00:34:39,280
an important question to hear different

907
00:34:42,869 --> 00:34:41,359
people's opinions so i'm going to ask

908
00:34:43,589 --> 00:34:42,879
you this

909
00:34:49,909 --> 00:34:43,599
the

910
00:34:50,710 --> 00:34:49,919
evidence would lead you to think that

911
00:34:51,909 --> 00:34:50,720
well

912
00:34:53,589 --> 00:34:51,919
uh

913
00:34:55,669 --> 00:34:53,599
first of all there was my own personal

914
00:34:57,670 --> 00:34:55,679
experience where

915
00:35:00,550 --> 00:34:57,680
i had a lot of really frightening and

916
00:35:02,710 --> 00:35:00,560
negative things happen to my own life

917
00:35:05,349 --> 00:35:02,720
and to people very close to me

918
00:35:06,870 --> 00:35:05,359
when i started to sort of

919
00:35:09,030 --> 00:35:06,880
what what i believe was i was getting

920
00:35:11,670 --> 00:35:09,040
closer to the truth about this thing

921
00:35:14,150 --> 00:35:11,680
during the time that i believed that

922
00:35:16,069 --> 00:35:14,160
ufos were aliens from space

923
00:35:18,550 --> 00:35:16,079
i did have some strange experiences but

924
00:35:20,550 --> 00:35:18,560
they were more in line with you know i

925
00:35:22,069 --> 00:35:20,560
thought that the government was tapping

926
00:35:23,670 --> 00:35:22,079
my phone for example i thought that the

927
00:35:25,990 --> 00:35:23,680
government was taking

928
00:35:27,589 --> 00:35:26,000
files that disappeared out of my filing

929
00:35:28,950 --> 00:35:27,599
cabinet and were later replaced with

930
00:35:31,750 --> 00:35:28,960
photocopies

931
00:35:32,550 --> 00:35:31,760
only later did i really start to realize

932
00:35:33,990 --> 00:35:32,560
okay

933
00:35:35,670 --> 00:35:34,000
i don't think that our government really

934
00:35:37,990 --> 00:35:35,680
knows what this stuff is and i don't

935
00:35:40,630 --> 00:35:38,000
think our government is um

936
00:35:43,190 --> 00:35:40,640
bothering with intimidating a teenage

937
00:35:46,710 --> 00:35:43,200
boy who has joined mufon and is

938
00:35:49,430 --> 00:35:46,720
subscribed to a ufo magazine

939
00:35:51,750 --> 00:35:49,440
when i started to kind of i think have a

940
00:35:53,510 --> 00:35:51,760
more clear picture and a better

941
00:35:56,470 --> 00:35:53,520
understanding of what was really going

942
00:35:58,150 --> 00:35:56,480
on i started to have extremely uh

943
00:36:00,310 --> 00:35:58,160
negative things happening to me in my

944
00:36:02,710 --> 00:36:00,320
own life and to people around me

945
00:36:04,870 --> 00:36:02,720
there were people that i knew that uh

946
00:36:08,230 --> 00:36:04,880
got institutionalized there were people

947
00:36:10,790 --> 00:36:08,240
that i knew who died and um i can't

948
00:36:13,190 --> 00:36:10,800
remember exactly who it was but there is

949
00:36:15,910 --> 00:36:13,200
a famous quote about ufo research that

950
00:36:17,990 --> 00:36:15,920
if you want to find the truth about ufos

951
00:36:19,829 --> 00:36:18,000
follow the trail of bodies i mean there

952
00:36:21,950 --> 00:36:19,839
have been a lot of people who have lost

953
00:36:23,510 --> 00:36:21,960
their lives in really unusual

954
00:36:26,390 --> 00:36:23,520
circumstances

955
00:36:27,270 --> 00:36:26,400
um that were i think maybe getting close

956
00:36:29,190 --> 00:36:27,280
to

957
00:36:31,670 --> 00:36:29,200
the reality of this thing and then if we

958
00:36:34,150 --> 00:36:31,680
kind of zoom out even from that if we

959
00:36:35,670 --> 00:36:34,160
look at the history of ufo sightings

960
00:36:37,990 --> 00:36:35,680
particularly

961
00:36:40,790 --> 00:36:38,000
reports of people who believe that they

962
00:36:43,510 --> 00:36:40,800
were on board the ufos or who were in

963
00:36:46,069 --> 00:36:43,520
contact with the ufo occupants we see

964
00:36:48,950 --> 00:36:46,079
again and again um

965
00:36:50,470 --> 00:36:48,960
people being ruined people dying

966
00:36:54,870 --> 00:36:50,480
um

967
00:36:57,109 --> 00:36:54,880
some interviews about it where i kind of

968
00:36:59,829 --> 00:36:57,119
talked about um

969
00:37:02,310 --> 00:36:59,839
my conclusions and i got i got some

970
00:37:04,069 --> 00:37:02,320
emails from somebody who was i thought

971
00:37:06,069 --> 00:37:04,079
really well informed there was a name

972
00:37:07,910 --> 00:37:06,079
that i didn't recognize but he had some

973
00:37:11,270 --> 00:37:07,920
questions that i thought were really on

974
00:37:13,589 --> 00:37:11,280
point and uh really kind of in line with

975
00:37:16,470 --> 00:37:13,599
with where my research has led me so i

976
00:37:19,349 --> 00:37:16,480
enjoyed corresponding with this person

977
00:37:21,430 --> 00:37:19,359
until one day i asked him i said listen

978
00:37:23,109 --> 00:37:21,440
um you know i gotta ask what's your

979
00:37:23,990 --> 00:37:23,119
background on this stuff what is your

980
00:37:25,750 --> 00:37:24,000
angle

981
00:37:27,190 --> 00:37:25,760
and he said well i was afraid of the day

982
00:37:29,349 --> 00:37:27,200
that you were going to ask me that

983
00:37:32,069 --> 00:37:29,359
question because the reality is is that

984
00:37:34,630 --> 00:37:32,079
uh i'm a baptist minister

985
00:37:36,550 --> 00:37:34,640
and i think that ufos are the demons

986
00:37:40,310 --> 00:37:36,560
that are described in the bible

987
00:37:42,630 --> 00:37:40,320
and i use material that you provide me

988
00:37:44,710 --> 00:37:42,640
for sermons to my congregation

989
00:37:46,230 --> 00:37:44,720
and i didn't respond to his email and i

990
00:37:48,550 --> 00:37:46,240
never talked to him again because that

991
00:37:50,230 --> 00:37:48,560
was the most ridiculous thing i'd ever

992
00:37:51,430 --> 00:37:50,240
heard i personally am not a religious

993
00:37:53,670 --> 00:37:51,440
person

994
00:37:55,829 --> 00:37:53,680
um and at the time

995
00:37:58,390 --> 00:37:55,839
it just sounded so ridiculous and i

996
00:38:01,349 --> 00:37:58,400
dismissed it out of hand as being absurd

997
00:38:03,670 --> 00:38:01,359
but looking back on it years later

998
00:38:05,349 --> 00:38:03,680
you know i'm not saying that i

999
00:38:07,589 --> 00:38:05,359
i'm not saying that i believe that ufos

1000
00:38:11,270 --> 00:38:07,599
are demons to be clear but there are

1001
00:38:14,150 --> 00:38:11,280
parallels there there absolutely are and

1002
00:38:16,630 --> 00:38:14,160
the parallels that are there are really

1003
00:38:18,630 --> 00:38:16,640
no less compelling than any other part

1004
00:38:21,030 --> 00:38:18,640
of the ufo narrative than anything about

1005
00:38:22,069 --> 00:38:21,040
ufos being from space and so

1006
00:38:23,670 --> 00:38:22,079
um

1007
00:38:26,310 --> 00:38:23,680
you know i think that

1008
00:38:28,230 --> 00:38:26,320
it can be very easy for for i understand

1009
00:38:30,310 --> 00:38:28,240
i obviously i'm a human being i have my

1010
00:38:32,550 --> 00:38:30,320
own biases

1011
00:38:34,150 --> 00:38:32,560
everybody does and it can be easy to

1012
00:38:35,510 --> 00:38:34,160
pick and choose

1013
00:38:37,190 --> 00:38:35,520
information

1014
00:38:39,430 --> 00:38:37,200
that fits your

1015
00:38:41,510 --> 00:38:39,440
proposal but i never wanted to do that i

1016
00:38:42,710 --> 00:38:41,520
always viewed myself as being a

1017
00:38:45,190 --> 00:38:42,720
scientist

1018
00:38:47,030 --> 00:38:45,200
objectivity was so important to me and

1019
00:38:49,270 --> 00:38:47,040
looking at things objectively and not

1020
00:38:51,109 --> 00:38:49,280
trying to prove any one hypothesis or

1021
00:38:52,950 --> 00:38:51,119
another that's

1022
00:38:55,910 --> 00:38:52,960
you know that's what i came up with and

1023
00:38:58,069 --> 00:38:55,920
uh and in fact i eventually

1024
00:39:01,270 --> 00:38:58,079
took a a pretty big step away from

1025
00:39:02,630 --> 00:39:01,280
active ufo investigation for a long time

1026
00:39:04,069 --> 00:39:02,640
partially because it became too

1027
00:39:06,150 --> 00:39:04,079
frightening for me

1028
00:39:08,150 --> 00:39:06,160
but also because i felt that i couldn't

1029
00:39:09,750 --> 00:39:08,160
be objective anymore because i had to

1030
00:39:11,829 --> 00:39:09,760
come to terms with what was happening to

1031
00:39:14,310 --> 00:39:11,839
me and realize

1032
00:39:17,670 --> 00:39:14,320
some of this is about me some of this is

1033
00:39:21,030 --> 00:39:17,680
about things that that i'm experiencing

1034
00:39:23,349 --> 00:39:21,040
and that really changed things for me

1035
00:39:24,470 --> 00:39:23,359
well i do remember when i first started

1036
00:39:26,950 --> 00:39:24,480
this

1037
00:39:29,829 --> 00:39:26,960
someone i was talking to said if you

1038
00:39:31,990 --> 00:39:29,839
look deeply into the ufo topic it will

1039
00:39:33,349 --> 00:39:32,000
look deeply back at you have you ever

1040
00:39:35,190 --> 00:39:33,359
heard that expression

1041
00:39:36,630 --> 00:39:35,200
i have and i believe that a hundred

1042
00:39:39,030 --> 00:39:36,640
percent and you know it's really

1043
00:39:40,870 --> 00:39:39,040
interesting because uh

1044
00:39:42,630 --> 00:39:40,880
i'm not going to drop names because i

1045
00:39:44,710 --> 00:39:42,640
don't want to speak on behalf of anybody

1046
00:39:47,910 --> 00:39:44,720
but there's somebody who

1047
00:39:49,270 --> 00:39:47,920
i worked with um as an investigator for

1048
00:39:51,510 --> 00:39:49,280
years who i have

1049
00:39:54,550 --> 00:39:51,520
tremendous respect for

1050
00:39:56,870 --> 00:39:54,560
and he has since moved away and i fell

1051
00:39:59,750 --> 00:39:56,880
out of touch with him for a long time

1052
00:40:01,349 --> 00:39:59,760
and more recently i have taken a more

1053
00:40:02,950 --> 00:40:01,359
active interest in kind of coming to

1054
00:40:04,550 --> 00:40:02,960
grips with some of the crazy stuff that

1055
00:40:05,990 --> 00:40:04,560
happened to me and what my life was like

1056
00:40:08,390 --> 00:40:06,000
in those years

1057
00:40:11,670 --> 00:40:08,400
and so i reached out to him and he was

1058
00:40:13,589 --> 00:40:11,680
thrilled to hear from me and i said

1059
00:40:15,349 --> 00:40:13,599
you know we never really talked about

1060
00:40:19,589 --> 00:40:15,359
this we never talked about the really

1061
00:40:21,270 --> 00:40:19,599
strange things that happened to us

1062
00:40:22,390 --> 00:40:21,280
and he was like i don't know what you're

1063
00:40:24,470 --> 00:40:22,400
talking about

1064
00:40:26,790 --> 00:40:24,480
and i started to kind of list some of

1065
00:40:28,630 --> 00:40:26,800
the really strange things that he and i

1066
00:40:30,309 --> 00:40:28,640
had experienced together

1067
00:40:32,309 --> 00:40:30,319
and his response was kind of like well i

1068
00:40:34,150 --> 00:40:32,319
don't i don't remember it that way i

1069
00:40:35,990 --> 00:40:34,160
don't remember it at all in some cases

1070
00:40:38,470 --> 00:40:36,000
but i know that these things happen i

1071
00:40:40,390 --> 00:40:38,480
have notes from the 1990s that describe

1072
00:40:41,829 --> 00:40:40,400
these things there were other people

1073
00:40:43,190 --> 00:40:41,839
that this stuff happened to there were

1074
00:40:44,550 --> 00:40:43,200
other people that were there and that

1075
00:40:48,309 --> 00:40:44,560
saw this stuff

1076
00:40:51,270 --> 00:40:48,319
and uh i wonder if cause i told him i

1077
00:40:54,230 --> 00:40:51,280
said you know i think that i became so

1078
00:40:56,710 --> 00:40:54,240
focused on ufos and put so much mental

1079
00:40:58,950 --> 00:40:56,720
energy into it that i popped up on the

1080
00:41:00,950 --> 00:40:58,960
radar of whatever this thing is and he

1081
00:41:03,349 --> 00:41:00,960
said well why didn't that happen to me

1082
00:41:05,430 --> 00:41:03,359
and i think that it did

1083
00:41:07,589 --> 00:41:05,440
but i wonder if maybe he

1084
00:41:09,589 --> 00:41:07,599
isn't on some level

1085
00:41:11,589 --> 00:41:09,599
not willing to admit it to himself or

1086
00:41:14,150 --> 00:41:11,599
he's not ready to

1087
00:41:15,030 --> 00:41:14,160
come to grips with what that would mean

1088
00:41:16,790 --> 00:41:15,040
um

1089
00:41:18,069 --> 00:41:16,800
because it is really hard you know it

1090
00:41:21,190 --> 00:41:18,079
took it took me

1091
00:41:22,790 --> 00:41:21,200
a long time to make any sense of it at

1092
00:41:24,470 --> 00:41:22,800
all in my mind

1093
00:41:25,670 --> 00:41:24,480
and

1094
00:41:27,349 --> 00:41:25,680
you know i think

1095
00:41:29,190 --> 00:41:27,359
everybody who

1096
00:41:31,589 --> 00:41:29,200
most of the people that i know who have

1097
00:41:33,829 --> 00:41:31,599
been active in ufo investigation they

1098
00:41:36,870 --> 00:41:33,839
have their own stories of the time that

1099
00:41:38,790 --> 00:41:36,880
um you know my phone died or all the

1100
00:41:40,470 --> 00:41:38,800
photographs didn't come out or whatever

1101
00:41:42,790 --> 00:41:40,480
it is you know everybody has these

1102
00:41:45,109 --> 00:41:42,800
stories and these stories add up to

1103
00:41:46,710 --> 00:41:45,119
something you know they mean something

1104
00:41:49,670 --> 00:41:46,720
and

1105
00:41:51,589 --> 00:41:49,680
ufo ufos as space aliens doesn't give us

1106
00:41:52,710 --> 00:41:51,599
an explanation for that kind of stuff i

1107
00:41:55,030 --> 00:41:52,720
don't think

1108
00:41:57,589 --> 00:41:55,040
right you know what i talked about or i

1109
00:41:59,829 --> 00:41:57,599
just mentioned lou elizondo another

1110
00:42:00,790 --> 00:41:59,839
interview i listened to him uh talk

1111
00:42:02,390 --> 00:42:00,800
about

1112
00:42:03,829 --> 00:42:02,400
that a superior

1113
00:42:06,150 --> 00:42:03,839
at the pentagon

1114
00:42:07,670 --> 00:42:06,160
told him that he thought that it was

1115
00:42:09,829 --> 00:42:07,680
demonic

1116
00:42:12,150 --> 00:42:09,839
which is really bizarre i mean you know

1117
00:42:14,150 --> 00:42:12,160
to hear that someone on that level would

1118
00:42:16,870 --> 00:42:14,160
think you know but i do i do realize a

1119
00:42:20,069 --> 00:42:16,880
lot of people do have religious beliefs

1120
00:42:21,910 --> 00:42:20,079
and it's probably like the catch-all for

1121
00:42:23,750 --> 00:42:21,920
not understanding something and being

1122
00:42:25,670 --> 00:42:23,760
scared of something is that it's demonic

1123
00:42:27,430 --> 00:42:25,680
maybe that's that's why it's used that

1124
00:42:30,950 --> 00:42:27,440
term is used

1125
00:42:34,710 --> 00:42:30,960
i don't know look demons could represent

1126
00:42:37,670 --> 00:42:34,720
another attempt at an explanation

1127
00:42:39,829 --> 00:42:37,680
for for what we call ufos you know or

1128
00:42:41,990 --> 00:42:39,839
what we call aliens or whatever it is

1129
00:42:44,309 --> 00:42:42,000
that aliens and demons could be two

1130
00:42:47,190 --> 00:42:44,319
different interpretations

1131
00:42:49,750 --> 00:42:47,200
of the same stimulus

1132
00:42:51,750 --> 00:42:49,760
and maybe neither of those

1133
00:42:54,470 --> 00:42:51,760
are really right right or maybe one or

1134
00:42:57,750 --> 00:42:54,480
the other is is more correct than the

1135
00:42:59,990 --> 00:42:57,760
other but i think we might just have to

1136
00:43:02,150 --> 00:43:00,000
understand that there's no explanation

1137
00:43:04,710 --> 00:43:02,160
for a lot of this stuff human beings are

1138
00:43:08,390 --> 00:43:04,720
having experiences that i think are

1139
00:43:11,270 --> 00:43:08,400
founded in objective reality that are

1140
00:43:13,750 --> 00:43:11,280
real that they are able to remember and

1141
00:43:16,390 --> 00:43:13,760
recount sincerely

1142
00:43:17,910 --> 00:43:16,400
and and we don't know what it is and uh

1143
00:43:20,230 --> 00:43:17,920
and i don't think we're going to know

1144
00:43:22,550 --> 00:43:20,240
you know i personally have become

1145
00:43:24,150 --> 00:43:22,560
really disheartened

1146
00:43:25,990 --> 00:43:24,160
i don't think that we're ever going to

1147
00:43:27,750 --> 00:43:26,000
have an answer for this stuff you know

1148
00:43:30,230 --> 00:43:27,760
we're even if we talk about

1149
00:43:32,630 --> 00:43:30,240
interdimensional or or demonic these

1150
00:43:35,030 --> 00:43:32,640
terms are really an attempt to explain a

1151
00:43:36,150 --> 00:43:35,040
mystery i think with another mystery and

1152
00:43:38,230 --> 00:43:36,160
in the end

1153
00:43:39,829 --> 00:43:38,240
it's just question marks something that

1154
00:43:41,349 --> 00:43:39,839
i wanted to to get in here while i'm

1155
00:43:42,470 --> 00:43:41,359
thinking about it

1156
00:43:44,309 --> 00:43:42,480
something that i think is really

1157
00:43:46,550 --> 00:43:44,319
important and that is mirrored by things

1158
00:43:48,630 --> 00:43:46,560
that happened to me is an experience

1159
00:43:51,190 --> 00:43:48,640
that was related by john keel in his

1160
00:43:55,430 --> 00:43:51,200
book the mothman prophecies he's talking

1161
00:43:56,870 --> 00:43:55,440
about seeing ufos hovering up in the sky

1162
00:44:00,710 --> 00:43:56,880
in the uh

1163
00:44:02,470 --> 00:44:00,720
in the hills over west virginia and he

1164
00:44:04,870 --> 00:44:02,480
he is trying to signal to them with his

1165
00:44:07,750 --> 00:44:04,880
flashlight and so he signals to them in

1166
00:44:09,910 --> 00:44:07,760
morse code i think the letter l and they

1167
00:44:12,150 --> 00:44:09,920
move to the left and he signals to them

1168
00:44:14,550 --> 00:44:12,160
in morse code r and they move to the

1169
00:44:16,390 --> 00:44:14,560
right so how could they understand the

1170
00:44:18,550 --> 00:44:16,400
language how could they understand the

1171
00:44:20,790 --> 00:44:18,560
spelling morse code it's all so

1172
00:44:23,109 --> 00:44:20,800
ridiculous so it occurred to him i'm

1173
00:44:25,109 --> 00:44:23,119
going to come up with an arbitrary code

1174
00:44:26,950 --> 00:44:25,119
where if i shine the light in a triangle

1175
00:44:28,950 --> 00:44:26,960
it means go left and if i shine it in a

1176
00:44:30,309 --> 00:44:28,960
circle it means go right and he did that

1177
00:44:31,990 --> 00:44:30,319
and they moved

1178
00:44:34,550 --> 00:44:32,000
so he realized

1179
00:44:36,550 --> 00:44:34,560
it wasn't that they understood

1180
00:44:37,990 --> 00:44:36,560
morse code or anything like that it was

1181
00:44:40,309 --> 00:44:38,000
that they were reading his mind they

1182
00:44:41,270 --> 00:44:40,319
were in contact with his mind and that

1183
00:44:43,109 --> 00:44:41,280
is

1184
00:44:46,309 --> 00:44:43,119
i believe

1185
00:44:49,270 --> 00:44:46,319
you know to put it in in his honest and

1186
00:44:53,190 --> 00:44:49,280
blunt terms as possible i believe that i

1187
00:44:55,589 --> 00:44:53,200
focused so heavily on ufos so much

1188
00:44:56,950 --> 00:44:55,599
that i eventually became in mental

1189
00:44:59,030 --> 00:44:56,960
communication with whatever this

1190
00:45:01,349 --> 00:44:59,040
intelligence is and i think that they

1191
00:45:03,349 --> 00:45:01,359
were they were trying to harm me and i

1192
00:45:06,710 --> 00:45:03,359
think they were trying to control me

1193
00:45:08,470 --> 00:45:06,720
and i'm glad and relieved that i made a

1194
00:45:11,270 --> 00:45:08,480
decision to to back away from some of

1195
00:45:13,270 --> 00:45:11,280
the things that i was doing so that

1196
00:45:16,230 --> 00:45:13,280
i wouldn't have this hanging over me

1197
00:45:20,069 --> 00:45:17,510
and i think that everybody who's

1198
00:45:21,430 --> 00:45:20,079
involved in ufo research i know that

1199
00:45:23,349 --> 00:45:21,440
people are going to scoff and listen to

1200
00:45:25,430 --> 00:45:23,359
this but i think it's very dangerous and

1201
00:45:27,190 --> 00:45:25,440
i think that everybody who's involved

1202
00:45:29,589 --> 00:45:27,200
needs to be very careful and needs to be

1203
00:45:31,190 --> 00:45:29,599
cognizant of the fact that there can be

1204
00:45:32,790 --> 00:45:31,200
really negative things that can happen

1205
00:45:36,470 --> 00:45:32,800
to people as a result of looking at this

1206
00:45:40,150 --> 00:45:36,480
stuff i'm convinced of that certainly

1207
00:45:41,430 --> 00:45:40,160
well you know uh so this this thought

1208
00:45:44,390 --> 00:45:41,440
that you have

1209
00:45:45,109 --> 00:45:44,400
that they're possibly already here

1210
00:45:50,150 --> 00:45:45,119
it

1211
00:45:52,550 --> 00:45:50,160
mentioned earlier about telepathy that

1212
00:45:55,589 --> 00:45:52,560
these school children but not only them

1213
00:45:58,150 --> 00:45:55,599
many people claim to have had with

1214
00:45:59,349 --> 00:45:58,160
these entities and that is take care of

1215
00:46:02,710 --> 00:45:59,359
the planet

1216
00:46:07,589 --> 00:46:02,720
then

1217
00:46:10,150 --> 00:46:07,599
even make more sense or

1218
00:46:11,670 --> 00:46:10,160
michael masters says he thinks that dr

1219
00:46:13,829 --> 00:46:11,680
michael masters thinks that they're from

1220
00:46:17,190 --> 00:46:13,839
the future and that would make sense in

1221
00:46:19,990 --> 00:46:17,200
that case as well possibly i don't know

1222
00:46:22,150 --> 00:46:20,000
look i i agree with you that um there

1223
00:46:24,150 --> 00:46:22,160
are elements of their messages that can

1224
00:46:26,870 --> 00:46:24,160
be used to

1225
00:46:28,470 --> 00:46:26,880
um try to extrapolate maybe what these

1226
00:46:31,349 --> 00:46:28,480
things could be but

1227
00:46:33,670 --> 00:46:31,359
i really think that

1228
00:46:34,790 --> 00:46:33,680
for me looking at all of the people that

1229
00:46:37,430 --> 00:46:34,800
have been

1230
00:46:38,870 --> 00:46:37,440
in communication with this stuff and all

1231
00:46:41,589 --> 00:46:38,880
of the

1232
00:46:43,430 --> 00:46:41,599
messages that they've conveyed and how

1233
00:46:45,510 --> 00:46:43,440
this has affected people and what the

1234
00:46:47,829 --> 00:46:45,520
actual practical effects and

1235
00:46:49,109 --> 00:46:47,839
ramifications have been on people from

1236
00:46:50,710 --> 00:46:49,119
this stuff

1237
00:46:53,030 --> 00:46:50,720
i think that they are deceptive i think

1238
00:46:55,030 --> 00:46:53,040
that they're lying and i i don't take

1239
00:46:57,030 --> 00:46:55,040
what they say at face value i think that

1240
00:46:58,630 --> 00:46:57,040
they want us to think

1241
00:47:00,950 --> 00:46:58,640
that they're aliens you know i think

1242
00:47:04,390 --> 00:47:00,960
that they want us to think certain

1243
00:47:06,950 --> 00:47:04,400
things and that they act somehow

1244
00:47:09,270 --> 00:47:06,960
in some way that we can't understand as

1245
00:47:11,109 --> 00:47:09,280
a control mechanism you know i i

1246
00:47:14,230 --> 00:47:11,119
personally have given up on trying to

1247
00:47:17,030 --> 00:47:14,240
understand their motivations i think

1248
00:47:19,670 --> 00:47:17,040
this is a metaphor that a lot of people

1249
00:47:22,069 --> 00:47:19,680
have probably used in the past but

1250
00:47:24,390 --> 00:47:22,079
that of ants in an ant farm trying to

1251
00:47:26,390 --> 00:47:24,400
guess at the motivation of the person

1252
00:47:27,990 --> 00:47:26,400
who puts the sugar water in there

1253
00:47:30,150 --> 00:47:28,000
they're never going to figure it out

1254
00:47:32,470 --> 00:47:30,160
because it's just a total other level of

1255
00:47:35,270 --> 00:47:32,480
being that they just can't grasp and i

1256
00:47:37,750 --> 00:47:35,280
think that's where we're at here

1257
00:47:39,589 --> 00:47:37,760
very well could be very well could be

1258
00:47:41,829 --> 00:47:39,599
what why but

1259
00:47:44,790 --> 00:47:41,839
using your thought process again here

1260
00:47:46,549 --> 00:47:44,800
why would they need a structured craft

1261
00:47:49,829 --> 00:47:46,559
i think that the appearance of the

1262
00:47:51,589 --> 00:47:49,839
structured craft is a deliberate ruse i

1263
00:47:54,150 --> 00:47:51,599
think that

1264
00:47:56,549 --> 00:47:54,160
they appear in various guises they

1265
00:47:59,750 --> 00:47:56,559
manifest themselves in various different

1266
00:48:01,990 --> 00:47:59,760
forms in order to get people to think

1267
00:48:04,069 --> 00:48:02,000
one thing or another about them

1268
00:48:05,510 --> 00:48:04,079
we alluded earlier to the bridgewater

1269
00:48:07,510 --> 00:48:05,520
triangle which is this area in

1270
00:48:10,390 --> 00:48:07,520
massachusetts which has a lot of ufo

1271
00:48:12,549 --> 00:48:10,400
sightings it also has had a lot of

1272
00:48:15,030 --> 00:48:12,559
bigfoot sightings over time and there's

1273
00:48:17,030 --> 00:48:15,040
a lot of haunted houses there and

1274
00:48:18,630 --> 00:48:17,040
there's all kinds of monster sightings

1275
00:48:20,870 --> 00:48:18,640
and creepy creatures and stuff that

1276
00:48:23,589 --> 00:48:20,880
people see out there in the swamp and

1277
00:48:25,750 --> 00:48:23,599
when i started to look at ufo sightings

1278
00:48:28,950 --> 00:48:25,760
there i was only interested in the ufo

1279
00:48:30,790 --> 00:48:28,960
sightings and so many times people would

1280
00:48:32,390 --> 00:48:30,800
report to me oh you know there was

1281
00:48:34,549 --> 00:48:32,400
another weird thing that happened to me

1282
00:48:35,990 --> 00:48:34,559
you know my house is haunted or the

1283
00:48:38,309 --> 00:48:36,000
neighbor said they saw a bigfoot

1284
00:48:40,230 --> 00:48:38,319
creature out in the back 40 or whatever

1285
00:48:42,230 --> 00:48:40,240
it is and i would sweep that stuff under

1286
00:48:43,750 --> 00:48:42,240
the rug i thought it was embarrassing

1287
00:48:47,270 --> 00:48:43,760
i thought it detracted from the

1288
00:48:53,510 --> 00:48:50,630
eventually i was forced to

1289
00:48:55,030 --> 00:48:53,520
to kind of admit to myself okay well

1290
00:48:56,790 --> 00:48:55,040
you know look there's not better

1291
00:48:58,630 --> 00:48:56,800
evidence for the ufo stuff in this

1292
00:49:00,710 --> 00:48:58,640
region than for the

1293
00:49:03,430 --> 00:49:00,720
the bigfoot stuff in this region or the

1294
00:49:05,270 --> 00:49:03,440
ghosts or whatever and and i can't

1295
00:49:07,349 --> 00:49:05,280
really

1296
00:49:09,030 --> 00:49:07,359
be claimed to be looking at this in a

1297
00:49:12,390 --> 00:49:09,040
scientific way

1298
00:49:14,150 --> 00:49:12,400
and and just forget about the fact that

1299
00:49:15,829 --> 00:49:14,160
what are the chances that's a this is a

1300
00:49:17,430 --> 00:49:15,839
coincidence that when i go to

1301
00:49:19,030 --> 00:49:17,440
investigate a ufo sighting there's a

1302
00:49:20,950 --> 00:49:19,040
bigfoot sighting that's associated with

1303
00:49:22,710 --> 00:49:20,960
it in some way or the many people who

1304
00:49:24,710 --> 00:49:22,720
told me they saw ufo and bigfoot at the

1305
00:49:26,390 --> 00:49:24,720
same time you know i'm using the term

1306
00:49:28,470 --> 00:49:26,400
bigfoot here as a as kind of a

1307
00:49:31,270 --> 00:49:28,480
colloquial term right people know what

1308
00:49:34,950 --> 00:49:31,280
i'm talking about it's just hairy

1309
00:49:36,069 --> 00:49:34,960
monster giant whatever it is um and so i

1310
00:49:37,510 --> 00:49:36,079
came to the conclusion all right well

1311
00:49:39,430 --> 00:49:37,520
i'd better start looking at this stuff

1312
00:49:40,710 --> 00:49:39,440
too and i looked at that stuff and came

1313
00:49:42,390 --> 00:49:40,720
to the conclusion that there is

1314
00:49:43,270 --> 00:49:42,400
absolutely a link between these two

1315
00:49:47,190 --> 00:49:43,280
things

1316
00:49:49,910 --> 00:49:47,200
and

1317
00:49:51,829 --> 00:49:49,920
what if there's an intelligence

1318
00:49:53,670 --> 00:49:51,839
that's trying to control how we think

1319
00:49:56,230 --> 00:49:53,680
about things we're trying to control how

1320
00:49:58,069 --> 00:49:56,240
we act in some way that we can't grasp

1321
00:50:00,549 --> 00:49:58,079
at because it's so alien to our human

1322
00:50:01,990 --> 00:50:00,559
intelligence that we can't figure out

1323
00:50:03,430 --> 00:50:02,000
what their motivation could possibly be

1324
00:50:05,349 --> 00:50:03,440
we just can't guess it

1325
00:50:07,990 --> 00:50:05,359
what if this intelligence

1326
00:50:10,150 --> 00:50:08,000
can use energy somehow to manifest

1327
00:50:13,109 --> 00:50:10,160
itself in different ways what if that

1328
00:50:16,390 --> 00:50:13,119
structured craft isn't really a metal

1329
00:50:20,150 --> 00:50:16,400
craft what if that bigfoot isn't really

1330
00:50:23,109 --> 00:50:20,160
a hairy monster that lives in the woods

1331
00:50:26,069 --> 00:50:23,119
but is a manifestation of something that

1332
00:50:28,309 --> 00:50:26,079
is presented to you that is in contact

1333
00:50:30,309 --> 00:50:28,319
with your mind that's responding to how

1334
00:50:33,349 --> 00:50:30,319
you're responding to it and that is what

1335
00:50:35,030 --> 00:50:33,359
i think is happening here

1336
00:50:37,510 --> 00:50:35,040
you know it's uh

1337
00:50:40,870 --> 00:50:37,520
it makes me wonder do you think that

1338
00:50:44,549 --> 00:50:40,880
these whatever they are are organic or

1339
00:50:47,030 --> 00:50:44,559
do you think it's like an energy instead

1340
00:50:48,390 --> 00:50:47,040
well i think that it's i think that it's

1341
00:50:49,510 --> 00:50:48,400
using energy

1342
00:50:52,150 --> 00:50:49,520
to

1343
00:50:54,390 --> 00:50:52,160
show itself and i don't think it's a

1344
00:50:57,270 --> 00:50:54,400
coin it's coincidence that we have so

1345
00:50:59,589 --> 00:50:57,280
many ufo sightings that are in the

1346
00:51:01,190 --> 00:50:59,599
vicinity of high tension power lines i

1347
00:51:03,030 --> 00:51:01,200
also don't think

1348
00:51:04,309 --> 00:51:03,040
that it's a coincidence that there are

1349
00:51:07,190 --> 00:51:04,319
so many

1350
00:51:08,390 --> 00:51:07,200
ufo sightings that are

1351
00:51:10,630 --> 00:51:08,400
that take place

1352
00:51:13,589 --> 00:51:10,640
adjacent to places that were important

1353
00:51:14,710 --> 00:51:13,599
to prehistoric people um i'll give you

1354
00:51:16,710 --> 00:51:14,720
kind of a

1355
00:51:18,470 --> 00:51:16,720
sort of a really quick overview of kind

1356
00:51:22,630 --> 00:51:18,480
of what i'm talking about here

1357
00:51:24,069 --> 00:51:22,640
um i'm really interested in these uh

1358
00:51:25,829 --> 00:51:24,079
man-made

1359
00:51:27,510 --> 00:51:25,839
stone constructions that are all over

1360
00:51:29,109 --> 00:51:27,520
new england that i think were built by

1361
00:51:30,790 --> 00:51:29,119
prehistoric native americans these

1362
00:51:33,270 --> 00:51:30,800
structures take many forms there are

1363
00:51:35,670 --> 00:51:33,280
stone rose like what we would call a

1364
00:51:37,270 --> 00:51:35,680
stone wall there are piles of stone and

1365
00:51:39,990 --> 00:51:37,280
there are also chambers which are

1366
00:51:42,069 --> 00:51:40,000
man-made underground caves of various

1367
00:51:45,349 --> 00:51:42,079
size they are very old

1368
00:51:47,109 --> 00:51:45,359
um i have uh you know i've visited many

1369
00:51:49,510 --> 00:51:47,119
many of these things over the years i'm

1370
00:51:52,390 --> 00:51:49,520
really interested in this aspect of

1371
00:51:54,710 --> 00:51:52,400
what i believe to be pre-history in new

1372
00:51:58,230 --> 00:51:54,720
england it is a fact that nobody really

1373
00:51:59,910 --> 00:51:58,240
knows how old these things are

1374
00:52:01,510 --> 00:51:59,920
that is to say there are there are

1375
00:52:03,510 --> 00:52:01,520
archaeologists that believe all of these

1376
00:52:05,430 --> 00:52:03,520
things date from colonial or

1377
00:52:07,750 --> 00:52:05,440
post-colonial time

1378
00:52:09,589 --> 00:52:07,760
there's not you know a parallel to ufos

1379
00:52:12,790 --> 00:52:09,599
here is that i don't think that there is

1380
00:52:14,390 --> 00:52:12,800
really any absolute proof that these are

1381
00:52:16,549 --> 00:52:14,400
pre-colonial but i think there's a

1382
00:52:17,430 --> 00:52:16,559
tremendous amount of evidence that they

1383
00:52:23,030 --> 00:52:17,440
are

1384
00:52:25,270 --> 00:52:23,040
detected at these places um just holding

1385
00:52:27,030 --> 00:52:25,280
a simple compass in your hand and

1386
00:52:28,870 --> 00:52:27,040
entering one of these structures you can

1387
00:52:31,670 --> 00:52:28,880
often see that compass needle start to

1388
00:52:32,870 --> 00:52:31,680
move sometimes really dramatically so

1389
00:52:34,390 --> 00:52:32,880
there's there's some kind of

1390
00:52:36,549 --> 00:52:34,400
electromagnetic

1391
00:52:38,710 --> 00:52:36,559
situation of some kind happening there

1392
00:52:41,030 --> 00:52:38,720
that we can measure with simple

1393
00:52:45,109 --> 00:52:41,040
instruments and i believe that in

1394
00:52:48,549 --> 00:52:45,119
prehistoric times before tv before 4g

1395
00:52:50,150 --> 00:52:48,559
before radio before electricity you know

1396
00:52:52,470 --> 00:52:50,160
i'm sitting in a room right now full of

1397
00:52:54,549 --> 00:52:52,480
electric lights in my phone and if i had

1398
00:52:57,589 --> 00:52:54,559
a meter i could read all of this stuff

1399
00:52:58,950 --> 00:52:57,599
now well people in prehistoric times

1400
00:53:00,790 --> 00:52:58,960
they didn't have any of that energy

1401
00:53:03,670 --> 00:53:00,800
around but i believe that they could

1402
00:53:05,430 --> 00:53:03,680
detect subtle changes in

1403
00:53:07,349 --> 00:53:05,440
the earth's energy in the earth's

1404
00:53:09,829 --> 00:53:07,359
electromagnetic field and that they

1405
00:53:12,390 --> 00:53:09,839
chose these places to be sacred and that

1406
00:53:14,630 --> 00:53:12,400
they made these places into places of

1407
00:53:17,109 --> 00:53:14,640
ritual and then today

1408
00:53:20,230 --> 00:53:17,119
um we see ufo sightings taking place in

1409
00:53:21,510 --> 00:53:20,240
these places and why if they're aliens

1410
00:53:23,270 --> 00:53:21,520
from space

1411
00:53:24,950 --> 00:53:23,280
why is there a correlation between

1412
00:53:27,030 --> 00:53:24,960
places where they're seen in places that

1413
00:53:28,950 --> 00:53:27,040
were important to prehistoric people but

1414
00:53:31,270 --> 00:53:28,960
if they're using energy

1415
00:53:32,870 --> 00:53:31,280
to show themselves then maybe there is

1416
00:53:35,829 --> 00:53:32,880
something about the energy that was

1417
00:53:38,230 --> 00:53:35,839
important to prehistoric people

1418
00:53:40,829 --> 00:53:38,240
that can be used by this phenomenon in

1419
00:53:45,430 --> 00:53:40,839
order to manifest itself or maybe

1420
00:53:47,670 --> 00:53:45,440
um prehistoric people created these uh

1421
00:53:49,510 --> 00:53:47,680
constructions at their sacred sites at

1422
00:53:51,109 --> 00:53:49,520
places that were sacred because they had

1423
00:53:53,430 --> 00:53:51,119
encounters there with some kind of

1424
00:53:55,190 --> 00:53:53,440
intelligence like the encounters that we

1425
00:53:57,190 --> 00:53:55,200
have there with some kind of

1426
00:53:58,870 --> 00:53:57,200
intelligence only in a different form

1427
00:54:01,190 --> 00:53:58,880
you know we can

1428
00:54:03,910 --> 00:54:01,200
so much of this there's there's no proof

1429
00:54:05,670 --> 00:54:03,920
of it and it's just all speculation but

1430
00:54:08,150 --> 00:54:05,680
but i think like i say i think there's

1431
00:54:09,510 --> 00:54:08,160
evidence for it and um you know that

1432
00:54:11,030 --> 00:54:09,520
those are kind of the conclusions that i

1433
00:54:12,790 --> 00:54:11,040
came up with

1434
00:54:15,270 --> 00:54:12,800
very very interesting we're going to be

1435
00:54:18,230 --> 00:54:15,280
going into break in just a second i when

1436
00:54:20,150 --> 00:54:18,240
i was i was in russia a few times and

1437
00:54:21,750 --> 00:54:20,160
got to look at the early dolmens they're

1438
00:54:23,910 --> 00:54:21,760
called dolmens and they're stone

1439
00:54:24,630 --> 00:54:23,920
structures with a little hole in them

1440
00:54:27,349 --> 00:54:24,640
that

1441
00:54:29,589 --> 00:54:27,359
it a body unless it's a real you know a

1442
00:54:30,950 --> 00:54:29,599
child couldn't really fit into them very

1443
00:54:32,549 --> 00:54:30,960
curious things and you're right about

1444
00:54:34,470 --> 00:54:32,559
stone they have absolutely no way to

1445
00:54:35,990 --> 00:54:34,480
date it you know the stone is a million

1446
00:54:37,109 --> 00:54:36,000
years old and it's not like pottery

1447
00:54:38,870 --> 00:54:37,119
where you can

1448
00:54:40,230 --> 00:54:38,880
or or would or something like that

1449
00:54:41,349 --> 00:54:40,240
something organic where you can get a

1450
00:54:43,670 --> 00:54:41,359
date on it

1451
00:54:45,430 --> 00:54:43,680
um we are ready to go into break it's a

1452
00:54:49,190 --> 00:54:45,440
four minute break

1453
00:54:50,789 --> 00:54:49,200
and uh the break of is over at kg r a

1454
00:54:53,109 --> 00:54:50,799
radio but i'm going to be going to be

1455
00:54:56,150 --> 00:54:53,119
playing a video and this is elton i

1456
00:54:59,589 --> 00:54:56,160
talked to he had a schoolyard um

1457
00:55:01,829 --> 00:54:59,599
ufo sighting in the 1960s in oakland

1458
00:55:03,190 --> 00:55:01,839
california and we're going to roll with

1459
00:55:05,510 --> 00:55:03,200
that so

1460
00:55:12,950 --> 00:55:05,520
over at kgra radio we'll be back in

1461
00:55:17,670 --> 00:55:14,270
the year is

1462
00:55:19,430 --> 00:55:17,680
1963 i'm in the third grade at franklin

1463
00:55:22,150 --> 00:55:19,440
grammar school

1464
00:55:25,109 --> 00:55:22,160
we're at recess and uh

1465
00:55:28,150 --> 00:55:25,119
i played marbles the entire half hour

1466
00:55:30,789 --> 00:55:28,160
and we were all waiting for the uh

1467
00:55:32,150 --> 00:55:30,799
the recess beltering to go back into

1468
00:55:34,069 --> 00:55:32,160
class

1469
00:55:36,069 --> 00:55:34,079
and i'm playing with my marbles with a

1470
00:55:38,630 --> 00:55:36,079
big pocketful of them and talking to a

1471
00:55:40,470 --> 00:55:38,640
buddy of mine and the bell rings and

1472
00:55:41,990 --> 00:55:40,480
everybody starts piling into their

1473
00:55:43,990 --> 00:55:42,000
classes

1474
00:55:45,829 --> 00:55:44,000
and i wasn't in a huge rush to go back

1475
00:55:47,670 --> 00:55:45,839
to class because i know we had an exam

1476
00:55:48,630 --> 00:55:47,680
of some kind

1477
00:55:53,750 --> 00:55:48,640
so

1478
00:55:55,030 --> 00:55:53,760
was a bright sunny day about 11 o'clock

1479
00:55:56,150 --> 00:55:55,040
uh before

1480
00:55:59,910 --> 00:55:56,160
noon

1481
00:56:00,870 --> 00:55:59,920
and i see this huge golden

1482
00:56:02,710 --> 00:56:00,880
thing

1483
00:56:04,789 --> 00:56:02,720
just sitting in the air

1484
00:56:07,270 --> 00:56:04,799
making no noise

1485
00:56:09,349 --> 00:56:07,280
and it's it's so bright i could only

1486
00:56:11,670 --> 00:56:09,359
look at it for two or three seconds

1487
00:56:13,910 --> 00:56:11,680
maybe not even that long at a time

1488
00:56:15,910 --> 00:56:13,920
and i noticed the guy was with couldn't

1489
00:56:17,349 --> 00:56:15,920
look at it it was too bright for him so

1490
00:56:20,309 --> 00:56:17,359
he went and

1491
00:56:21,910 --> 00:56:20,319
after about 20 or 30 minutes i i

1492
00:56:23,030 --> 00:56:21,920
couldn't bear to look at it it was so

1493
00:56:26,230 --> 00:56:23,040
painful

1494
00:56:28,870 --> 00:56:26,240
and i looked around and i noticed it was

1495
00:56:30,549 --> 00:56:28,880
so huge the craft itself was blocking

1496
00:56:32,309 --> 00:56:30,559
the sun so i could

1497
00:56:34,789 --> 00:56:32,319
remember thinking to myself how could it

1498
00:56:35,829 --> 00:56:34,799
be so bright under there it was solid

1499
00:56:40,789 --> 00:56:35,839
gold

1500
00:56:41,750 --> 00:56:40,799
very convoluted and sculptured from

1501
00:56:44,789 --> 00:56:41,760
below

1502
00:56:47,270 --> 00:56:44,799
and it seemed like the height it seemed

1503
00:56:50,069 --> 00:56:47,280
like i could throw a marble and hit it

1504
00:56:51,589 --> 00:56:50,079
it was probably a hundred feet up

1505
00:56:53,190 --> 00:56:51,599
and so let me just ask you a couple

1506
00:56:54,950 --> 00:56:53,200
things first of all this is in oakland

1507
00:56:55,990 --> 00:56:54,960
california for

1508
00:56:58,390 --> 00:56:56,000
example

1509
00:56:59,750 --> 00:56:58,400
and when you saw this

1510
00:57:01,430 --> 00:56:59,760
uh you were out on the playground you

1511
00:57:02,309 --> 00:57:01,440
wanted to go in how many kids would you

1512
00:57:04,150 --> 00:57:02,319
say

1513
00:57:06,789 --> 00:57:04,160
uh were out there at the time and how

1514
00:57:08,710 --> 00:57:06,799
many were was there yelling and anything

1515
00:57:12,150 --> 00:57:08,720
else going on yeah there was must have

1516
00:57:13,670 --> 00:57:12,160
been a hundred kids on the lot and uh

1517
00:57:15,910 --> 00:57:13,680
the bell rang

1518
00:57:17,270 --> 00:57:15,920
everybody started piling into class and

1519
00:57:19,750 --> 00:57:17,280
by the time

1520
00:57:22,470 --> 00:57:19,760
i got to class i was the only one on the

1521
00:57:23,190 --> 00:57:22,480
uh on the pavement

1522
00:57:24,549 --> 00:57:23,200
because

1523
00:57:26,230 --> 00:57:24,559
i just couldn't believe it it was the

1524
00:57:29,190 --> 00:57:26,240
most beautiful thing i've ever seen in

1525
00:57:32,069 --> 00:57:29,200
my life there's no way in the world i

1526
00:57:34,230 --> 00:57:32,079
could have imagined something like that

1527
00:57:36,069 --> 00:57:34,240
it was so bright and beautiful but it

1528
00:57:37,349 --> 00:57:36,079
was frustrating because i could only

1529
00:57:39,670 --> 00:57:37,359
look at it for

1530
00:57:41,190 --> 00:57:39,680
two or three seconds at a time then i

1531
00:57:43,030 --> 00:57:41,200
had to look down

1532
00:57:44,309 --> 00:57:43,040
and rest my eyes for a second you know

1533
00:57:46,870 --> 00:57:44,319
what i mean

1534
00:57:48,789 --> 00:57:46,880
yeah and uh did you tell teachers your

1535
00:57:50,789 --> 00:57:48,799
parents or anyone

1536
00:57:53,109 --> 00:57:50,799
gosh you know to be honest with you i

1537
00:57:55,030 --> 00:57:53,119
didn't tell anybody for four or five

1538
00:57:57,270 --> 00:57:55,040
years

1539
00:57:58,870 --> 00:57:57,280
and then i looked uh to see if i could

1540
00:58:01,910 --> 00:57:58,880
find if there were any other sightings

1541
00:58:04,710 --> 00:58:01,920
that year because it was just incredible

1542
00:58:06,710 --> 00:58:04,720
it was just incredible so then i finally

1543
00:58:08,390 --> 00:58:06,720
i said man this thing is frustrating and

1544
00:58:09,910 --> 00:58:08,400
i never felt scared

1545
00:58:12,549 --> 00:58:09,920
because it was just sitting there and i

1546
00:58:14,549 --> 00:58:12,559
kept thinking how could it possibly just

1547
00:58:16,150 --> 00:58:14,559
sit there and not make any sounds let's

1548
00:58:17,109 --> 00:58:16,160
hold it up

1549
00:58:18,549 --> 00:58:17,119
and uh

1550
00:58:20,870 --> 00:58:18,559
did you see it leave

1551
00:58:23,829 --> 00:58:20,880
no i didn't i had to get back to class

1552
00:58:25,589 --> 00:58:23,839
because um i i think i might have spent

1553
00:58:27,510 --> 00:58:25,599
seven or eight minutes i was late to

1554
00:58:30,630 --> 00:58:27,520
class

1555
00:58:32,950 --> 00:58:30,640
yeah yeah well uh that this is all

1556
00:58:34,710 --> 00:58:32,960
really fascinating and uh so we're at

1557
00:58:36,390 --> 00:58:34,720
the end of our time but thank you so

1558
00:58:37,829 --> 00:58:36,400
much elton i really appreciate you

1559
00:58:39,430 --> 00:58:37,839
talking about it and now maybe we can

1560
00:58:41,270 --> 00:58:39,440
talk about this more sometime because it

1561
00:58:43,589 --> 00:58:41,280
really yeah i have the other siding too

1562
00:58:45,030 --> 00:58:43,599
i can tell you about i don't know if you

1563
00:58:46,710 --> 00:58:45,040
i think you might have

1564
00:58:49,109 --> 00:58:46,720
mentioned it yeah we talked about on the

1565
00:59:11,030 --> 00:58:49,119
phone we'll we'll have you back on again

1566
00:59:18,309 --> 00:59:12,630
and we should be coming back in about 10

1567
00:59:21,589 --> 00:59:19,430
in three

1568
00:59:23,750 --> 00:59:21,599
two one go

1569
00:59:26,470 --> 00:59:23,760
all right welcome back my guest uh

1570
00:59:28,230 --> 00:59:26,480
fascinating conversation is uh with uh

1571
00:59:30,150 --> 00:59:28,240
chris pittman

1572
00:59:31,430 --> 00:59:30,160
welcome back chris

1573
00:59:33,829 --> 00:59:31,440
thanks

1574
00:59:36,069 --> 00:59:33,839
uh yeah so this is uh this is all

1575
00:59:37,430 --> 00:59:36,079
fascinating that's why i like to have i

1576
00:59:39,990 --> 00:59:37,440
didn't know you're gonna go into this

1577
00:59:43,190 --> 00:59:40,000
direction and i think it's

1578
00:59:44,870 --> 00:59:43,200
very interesting and i don't discount

1579
00:59:45,829 --> 00:59:44,880
anything because i certainly don't

1580
00:59:48,150 --> 00:59:45,839
believe

1581
00:59:50,069 --> 00:59:48,160
that anyone out there really truly has

1582
00:59:51,990 --> 00:59:50,079
an answer and the theories are all we

1583
00:59:52,870 --> 00:59:52,000
can really rely on

1584
00:59:55,829 --> 00:59:52,880
but

1585
00:59:58,309 --> 00:59:55,839
so let's just say that it's possible

1586
01:00:00,390 --> 00:59:58,319
whatever these things are

1587
01:00:02,950 --> 01:00:00,400
are just some type of energy and they

1588
01:00:05,589 --> 01:00:02,960
have way ways of uh

1589
01:00:06,710 --> 01:00:05,599
of cloaking and ways of

1590
01:00:09,030 --> 01:00:06,720
um

1591
01:00:10,309 --> 01:00:09,040
of making us think that they are

1592
01:00:12,549 --> 01:00:10,319
something else

1593
01:00:15,589 --> 01:00:12,559
um

1594
01:00:17,910 --> 01:00:15,599
where would they you know this is again

1595
01:00:19,750 --> 01:00:17,920
nothing you can prove it's all just you

1596
01:00:21,750 --> 01:00:19,760
know your theories and thoughts on this

1597
01:00:23,990 --> 01:00:21,760
but where would something like that i

1598
01:00:26,150 --> 01:00:24,000
don't know if the right word is called

1599
01:00:27,270 --> 01:00:26,160
housed where would they be housed where

1600
01:00:31,829 --> 01:00:27,280
would they

1601
01:00:33,190 --> 01:00:31,839
you know that's that's it's a tough

1602
01:00:35,270 --> 01:00:33,200
question it's i don't really have an

1603
01:00:37,990 --> 01:00:35,280
answer for it um

1604
01:00:39,910 --> 01:00:38,000
i don't think that these things

1605
01:00:41,670 --> 01:00:39,920
you know again

1606
01:00:42,630 --> 01:00:41,680
like you say

1607
01:00:44,069 --> 01:00:42,640
look

1608
01:00:45,349 --> 01:00:44,079
i don't think anybody has an answer

1609
01:00:47,829 --> 01:00:45,359
nobody has an answer these things are

1610
01:00:49,430 --> 01:00:47,839
unidentified so um

1611
01:00:52,069 --> 01:00:49,440
there's also there's a possibility that

1612
01:00:53,670 --> 01:00:52,079
some of these things could be uh aliens

1613
01:00:55,270 --> 01:00:53,680
from space and structured craft it is

1614
01:00:57,750 --> 01:00:55,280
certainly possible

1615
01:00:59,430 --> 01:00:57,760
that some percentage of ufo sightings

1616
01:01:02,309 --> 01:00:59,440
represent that and and some of them

1617
01:01:03,829 --> 01:01:02,319
could also represent this um based on

1618
01:01:05,030 --> 01:01:03,839
this planet intelligence that i'm

1619
01:01:07,270 --> 01:01:05,040
talking about

1620
01:01:08,230 --> 01:01:07,280
but i think i don't think it's possible

1621
01:01:09,670 --> 01:01:08,240
i don't think it's ever going to be

1622
01:01:11,349 --> 01:01:09,680
possible for us

1623
01:01:13,670 --> 01:01:11,359
to walk up to

1624
01:01:15,510 --> 01:01:13,680
the ufos that are responsible for

1625
01:01:17,190 --> 01:01:15,520
abducting people that are responsible

1626
01:01:19,829 --> 01:01:17,200
for the majority of the sightings that

1627
01:01:22,390 --> 01:01:19,839
i've investigated

1628
01:01:23,750 --> 01:01:22,400
and just kick the tires and take a piece

1629
01:01:25,910 --> 01:01:23,760
of metal off

1630
01:01:28,789 --> 01:01:25,920
i don't think that these things exist in

1631
01:01:30,549 --> 01:01:28,799
our they exist in an objective reality

1632
01:01:32,549 --> 01:01:30,559
and that we can see them we can record

1633
01:01:35,349 --> 01:01:32,559
them we can measure them but i don't

1634
01:01:37,430 --> 01:01:35,359
think they exist in our physical reality

1635
01:01:41,510 --> 01:01:37,440
in the sense of

1636
01:01:42,870 --> 01:01:41,520
that we could fly a ufo into a hangar

1637
01:01:44,309 --> 01:01:42,880
and take it apart and find out what

1638
01:01:46,549 --> 01:01:44,319
makes it go

1639
01:01:48,950 --> 01:01:46,559
you know there there are certainly

1640
01:01:50,950 --> 01:01:48,960
things that we don't know about there's

1641
01:01:53,430 --> 01:01:50,960
we don't know what's at the bottom of a

1642
01:01:54,470 --> 01:01:53,440
lot of the ocean we don't know

1643
01:01:56,630 --> 01:01:54,480
um

1644
01:01:58,950 --> 01:01:56,640
you know there's what might be under the

1645
01:02:01,109 --> 01:01:58,960
ground in some places so there's always

1646
01:02:04,069 --> 01:02:01,119
the possibility that

1647
01:02:05,750 --> 01:02:04,079
there could be some kind of terrestrial

1648
01:02:08,069 --> 01:02:05,760
race that we don't know about is

1649
01:02:09,109 --> 01:02:08,079
absolutely laughable is that sound i i

1650
01:02:13,430 --> 01:02:09,119
wouldn't

1651
01:02:15,910 --> 01:02:13,440
that was somehow found and confirmed to

1652
01:02:18,950 --> 01:02:15,920
be real but i think the stuff that i'm

1653
01:02:21,510 --> 01:02:18,960
talking about it exists in some realm

1654
01:02:23,430 --> 01:02:21,520
you know like i say interdimensional or

1655
01:02:25,910 --> 01:02:23,440
pick whatever other term you want to

1656
01:02:28,710 --> 01:02:25,920
describe something that nobody knows

1657
01:02:31,270 --> 01:02:28,720
what it is or what it really means

1658
01:02:33,029 --> 01:02:31,280
yes we're we're actually in the uh

1659
01:02:34,710 --> 01:02:33,039
another half hour so i'm going to be

1660
01:02:36,470 --> 01:02:34,720
opening the phone lines we're having a

1661
01:02:37,670 --> 01:02:36,480
couple of questions pop in here and i'm

1662
01:02:39,510 --> 01:02:37,680
sure people

1663
01:02:41,990 --> 01:02:39,520
want to talk to you uh that is a screen

1664
01:02:43,430 --> 01:02:42,000
call would be coming in um so anyway

1665
01:02:45,670 --> 01:02:43,440
here's another question that pops up

1666
01:02:48,150 --> 01:02:45,680
here and i believe i talked about this

1667
01:02:49,750 --> 01:02:48,160
myself just a minute ago michael masters

1668
01:02:51,589 --> 01:02:49,760
is thinking about

1669
01:02:55,349 --> 01:02:51,599
this question here do you think some of

1670
01:02:57,670 --> 01:02:55,359
these are us from the future

1671
01:03:00,829 --> 01:02:57,680
if there is ever going to be time travel

1672
01:03:03,589 --> 01:03:00,839
then time travelers would be here now

1673
01:03:05,270 --> 01:03:03,599
yeah and and i had another thought on

1674
01:03:07,349 --> 01:03:05,280
that and i actually threw this at

1675
01:03:09,349 --> 01:03:07,359
michael masters the other day kind of in

1676
01:03:10,309 --> 01:03:09,359
a joking way we were kind of joking back

1677
01:03:13,109 --> 01:03:10,319
and forth

1678
01:03:16,309 --> 01:03:13,119
but i said well you know perhaps

1679
01:03:18,309 --> 01:03:16,319
we get totally wiped out from ai or say

1680
01:03:19,270 --> 01:03:18,319
we get wiped out from nuclear war or

1681
01:03:20,789 --> 01:03:19,280
whatever

1682
01:03:24,069 --> 01:03:20,799
and um

1683
01:03:25,990 --> 01:03:24,079
millions of years from now but not so

1684
01:03:28,069 --> 01:03:26,000
far into the future where the earth i

1685
01:03:29,109 --> 01:03:28,079
mean the sun is going to expand and you

1686
01:03:31,829 --> 01:03:29,119
know

1687
01:03:34,390 --> 01:03:31,839
it'll be over then anyway but uh

1688
01:03:36,789 --> 01:03:34,400
before that perhaps a new species

1689
01:03:38,950 --> 01:03:36,799
develops from scratch

1690
01:03:40,630 --> 01:03:38,960
that is traveling back to see what this

1691
01:03:42,309 --> 01:03:40,640
species was like

1692
01:03:44,549 --> 01:03:42,319
you know i mean why why couldn't it be

1693
01:03:48,150 --> 01:03:44,559
that you know if time is time and you

1694
01:03:52,630 --> 01:03:51,109
up we lost our audio chris chris we

1695
01:03:54,230 --> 01:03:52,640
can't hear you

1696
01:03:56,069 --> 01:03:54,240
um you may have to do whatever you did

1697
01:03:58,870 --> 01:03:56,079
last time

1698
01:04:00,150 --> 01:03:58,880
and that might be mean going out so uh

1699
01:04:02,309 --> 01:04:00,160
and if you have to go out and come back

1700
01:04:04,150 --> 01:04:02,319
and go ahead keep talking still can't

1701
01:04:06,870 --> 01:04:04,160
hear you

1702
01:04:09,270 --> 01:04:06,880
all right and if worse comes to worse um

1703
01:04:12,470 --> 01:04:09,280
i'm going to uh text you the phone

1704
01:04:15,270 --> 01:04:12,480
number here so i'm going to pop up this

1705
01:04:18,069 --> 01:04:15,280
other question here that um i will post

1706
01:04:21,510 --> 01:04:18,079
to him when he comes back

1707
01:04:24,309 --> 01:04:21,520
and that question is from esoteric gold

1708
01:04:27,270 --> 01:04:24,319
has our guest ever had an increase or

1709
01:04:28,549 --> 01:04:27,280
decrease in health issues during a ufo

1710
01:04:31,109 --> 01:04:28,559
experience

1711
01:04:32,710 --> 01:04:31,119
hey can you hear me i can hear you now

1712
01:04:35,109 --> 01:04:32,720
so this is really weird because i didn't

1713
01:04:37,750 --> 01:04:35,119
do anything so obviously as you can tell

1714
01:04:38,870 --> 01:04:37,760
this is the demonic ufo aliens it has to

1715
01:04:40,470 --> 01:04:38,880
be

1716
01:04:41,829 --> 01:04:40,480
all right are men in black or the

1717
01:04:43,430 --> 01:04:41,839
government it could be the government

1718
01:04:45,270 --> 01:04:43,440
could be the government they don't want

1719
01:04:46,630 --> 01:04:45,280
this information getting out that's the

1720
01:04:50,470 --> 01:04:46,640
that's right that's right they're going

1721
01:04:52,309 --> 01:04:50,480
to mess with my audio visual can stay

1722
01:04:54,390 --> 01:04:52,319
so uh here's a question up here you can

1723
01:04:56,309 --> 01:04:54,400
see it in the chat i just read it have

1724
01:04:57,750 --> 01:04:56,319
you ever had any increase or decrease in

1725
01:05:00,230 --> 01:04:57,760
health

1726
01:05:03,910 --> 01:05:00,240
experiences during ufo

1727
01:05:04,950 --> 01:05:03,920
well here's a here's a fun one

1728
01:05:08,230 --> 01:05:04,960
so

1729
01:05:11,270 --> 01:05:08,240
it was in the year 2000 that things kind

1730
01:05:13,430 --> 01:05:11,280
of came to a head for me with ufo study

1731
01:05:14,870 --> 01:05:13,440
um i had gotten to the point where i was

1732
01:05:18,230 --> 01:05:14,880
convinced that i was in mental

1733
01:05:20,630 --> 01:05:18,240
communication with ufo occupants i could

1734
01:05:22,710 --> 01:05:20,640
predict where ufos were going to appear

1735
01:05:25,670 --> 01:05:22,720
and then other people in some cases

1736
01:05:28,150 --> 01:05:25,680
would see them everybody in my life at

1737
01:05:31,029 --> 01:05:28,160
that time was having absolutely

1738
01:05:33,270 --> 01:05:31,039
bizarre encounters my my girl my

1739
01:05:34,549 --> 01:05:33,280
girlfriend at the time kind of had some

1740
01:05:37,029 --> 01:05:34,559
things happen to her that caused her

1741
01:05:38,710 --> 01:05:37,039
life to change forever in some ways

1742
01:05:39,829 --> 01:05:38,720
um

1743
01:05:42,150 --> 01:05:39,839
and

1744
01:05:44,789 --> 01:05:42,160
i i was like all right enough is enough

1745
01:05:46,789 --> 01:05:44,799
and i stu i basically was like i'm not

1746
01:05:48,230 --> 01:05:46,799
going to read about ufos anymore i'm not

1747
01:05:49,910 --> 01:05:48,240
going to think about ufos anymore i'm

1748
01:05:51,510 --> 01:05:49,920
going to stop talking to my friends i'm

1749
01:05:54,309 --> 01:05:51,520
gonna um

1750
01:05:56,230 --> 01:05:54,319
basically start a new ufo free life for

1751
01:05:57,910 --> 01:05:56,240
a while anyway

1752
01:05:59,829 --> 01:05:57,920
and i was still

1753
01:06:01,349 --> 01:05:59,839
waking up in the morning knowing things

1754
01:06:02,950 --> 01:06:01,359
that i hadn't known the night before

1755
01:06:05,349 --> 01:06:02,960
about ufos

1756
01:06:08,069 --> 01:06:05,359
and so i felt that i was still

1757
01:06:10,069 --> 01:06:08,079
getting communications from these ufo

1758
01:06:11,190 --> 01:06:10,079
occupants

1759
01:06:13,750 --> 01:06:11,200
and uh

1760
01:06:16,630 --> 01:06:13,760
they started to become fewer and fewer

1761
01:06:18,870 --> 01:06:16,640
in frequency and then i got what i felt

1762
01:06:20,309 --> 01:06:18,880
was a final communication

1763
01:06:22,789 --> 01:06:20,319
and the message of the final

1764
01:06:25,670 --> 01:06:22,799
communication was

1765
01:06:28,630 --> 01:06:25,680
you need to give up materialism you need

1766
01:06:31,029 --> 01:06:28,640
to give up all of your belongings and

1767
01:06:33,589 --> 01:06:31,039
you need to study

1768
01:06:36,549 --> 01:06:33,599
like eastern religions and spirituality

1769
01:06:38,230 --> 01:06:36,559
and if you don't do it you will die in

1770
01:06:39,270 --> 01:06:38,240
2012

1771
01:06:40,470 --> 01:06:39,280
and

1772
01:06:42,950 --> 01:06:40,480
um

1773
01:06:47,109 --> 01:06:45,349
i thought about it and i decided that

1774
01:06:48,470 --> 01:06:47,119
i'm not going to give up all of my stuff

1775
01:06:50,069 --> 01:06:48,480
and i'm not going to jump through their

1776
01:06:51,750 --> 01:06:50,079
hoop i'm not going to do what they want

1777
01:06:54,150 --> 01:06:51,760
me to do and i'm not going to start

1778
01:06:56,870 --> 01:06:54,160
studying eastern religions so

1779
01:06:59,270 --> 01:06:56,880
so be it maybe i'll die in 2012 right

1780
01:07:00,390 --> 01:06:59,280
so in 2011

1781
01:07:02,069 --> 01:07:00,400
i gave

1782
01:07:04,150 --> 01:07:02,079
a lecture

1783
01:07:05,990 --> 01:07:04,160
at a local

1784
01:07:07,029 --> 01:07:06,000
to a local paranormal

1785
01:07:09,349 --> 01:07:07,039
club

1786
01:07:11,829 --> 01:07:09,359
people that were interested in ufos as

1787
01:07:13,190 --> 01:07:11,839
well as a host of other things some of

1788
01:07:14,630 --> 01:07:13,200
which i think are interesting and some

1789
01:07:16,150 --> 01:07:14,640
of which i thought were

1790
01:07:18,309 --> 01:07:16,160
ridiculous

1791
01:07:20,150 --> 01:07:18,319
and at the end of my talk some people

1792
01:07:21,029 --> 01:07:20,160
who were in the audience wanted to talk

1793
01:07:23,750 --> 01:07:21,039
to me

1794
01:07:25,430 --> 01:07:23,760
and there was a woman who uh identified

1795
01:07:27,589 --> 01:07:25,440
herself as a psychic

1796
01:07:30,870 --> 01:07:27,599
and she told me that there was a spot on

1797
01:07:33,190 --> 01:07:30,880
my aura which sounded so absurd and

1798
01:07:35,510 --> 01:07:33,200
laughable but these people had been very

1799
01:07:37,750 --> 01:07:35,520
nice to me and so i was going to be

1800
01:07:39,029 --> 01:07:37,760
polite and i said oh well geez i don't i

1801
01:07:41,190 --> 01:07:39,039
don't really know anything about that i

1802
01:07:42,549 --> 01:07:41,200
don't know about a spot on my aura

1803
01:07:43,990 --> 01:07:42,559
and they said well think about it is

1804
01:07:46,630 --> 01:07:44,000
there anything that you can think of

1805
01:07:47,430 --> 01:07:46,640
maybe something even related to your ufo

1806
01:07:50,309 --> 01:07:47,440
work

1807
01:07:51,990 --> 01:07:50,319
where you felt that maybe

1808
01:07:54,710 --> 01:07:52,000
there was some

1809
01:07:56,870 --> 01:07:54,720
negative thing a curse or something you

1810
01:07:58,470 --> 01:07:56,880
know i can't remember the exact wording

1811
01:08:00,870 --> 01:07:58,480
but i said well you know it is funny

1812
01:08:02,710 --> 01:08:00,880
that you say that because um i felt like

1813
01:08:04,870 --> 01:08:02,720
aliens told me that i was going to die

1814
01:08:07,349 --> 01:08:04,880
next year and i'm saying this in the

1815
01:08:09,670 --> 01:08:07,359
most light-hearted way possible because

1816
01:08:12,710 --> 01:08:09,680
this is all such an absurd

1817
01:08:14,870 --> 01:08:12,720
thing right i'm not trying to discount

1818
01:08:15,829 --> 01:08:14,880
you know before you freak out listen to

1819
01:08:17,430 --> 01:08:15,839
the end of the story because i'm not

1820
01:08:18,550 --> 01:08:17,440
trying to discount anything that anybody

1821
01:08:19,749 --> 01:08:18,560
said here

1822
01:08:21,749 --> 01:08:19,759
and so

1823
01:08:24,630 --> 01:08:21,759
the woman said well i can remove spots

1824
01:08:25,990 --> 01:08:24,640
from from human auras and i would if

1825
01:08:27,910 --> 01:08:26,000
you're okay with it i would like to

1826
01:08:29,990 --> 01:08:27,920
remove the spot from your aura and i

1827
01:08:31,349 --> 01:08:30,000
said all right sure go for it

1828
01:08:32,870 --> 01:08:31,359
she said well i've got someone else here

1829
01:08:34,709 --> 01:08:32,880
that i'm training how to do this do you

1830
01:08:35,829 --> 01:08:34,719
do you mind if she works with us on this

1831
01:08:36,950 --> 01:08:35,839
and i was like how long is this going to

1832
01:08:38,789 --> 01:08:36,960
take she's like it's not going to take

1833
01:08:40,470 --> 01:08:38,799
very long it's very fast i said okay

1834
01:08:42,950 --> 01:08:40,480
sure go for it whatever

1835
01:08:44,789 --> 01:08:42,960
so the woman took my hand into her hand

1836
01:08:47,189 --> 01:08:44,799
and i was feeling so awkward that my

1837
01:08:48,789 --> 01:08:47,199
skin was crawling i was like this is

1838
01:08:51,030 --> 01:08:48,799
madness

1839
01:08:53,430 --> 01:08:51,040
she took my hand and she started to

1840
01:08:56,229 --> 01:08:53,440
press with her thumb into the palm of my

1841
01:08:58,789 --> 01:08:56,239
hand and she started to say something

1842
01:08:59,910 --> 01:08:58,799
and it's like i went into a trance and

1843
01:09:01,829 --> 01:08:59,920
the next

1844
01:09:03,749 --> 01:09:01,839
moment that i remember she was like okay

1845
01:09:04,829 --> 01:09:03,759
it's done it was a success your spot is

1846
01:09:08,630 --> 01:09:04,839
gone

1847
01:09:10,950 --> 01:09:08,640
and i have never felt so good in my

1848
01:09:13,349 --> 01:09:10,960
entire life i felt like i could run

1849
01:09:15,990 --> 01:09:13,359
through walls i felt like i mean i can't

1850
01:09:18,390 --> 01:09:16,000
even describe how good this thing made

1851
01:09:21,749 --> 01:09:18,400
me feel i thanked the woman profusely

1852
01:09:24,470 --> 01:09:21,759
never knew her name um and i had been

1853
01:09:25,829 --> 01:09:24,480
planning that night to go out go home

1854
01:09:27,829 --> 01:09:25,839
and go to sleep because i was feeling

1855
01:09:29,030 --> 01:09:27,839
worn out and instead i like went and

1856
01:09:30,709 --> 01:09:29,040
hung out with my friends and like

1857
01:09:32,709 --> 01:09:30,719
partied all night long and had a

1858
01:09:34,950 --> 01:09:32,719
fantastic time because i had never had

1859
01:09:36,630 --> 01:09:34,960
so much energy in my whole life so what

1860
01:09:38,390 --> 01:09:36,640
the heck was that you know i don't have

1861
01:09:39,510 --> 01:09:38,400
an answer to what that represents or

1862
01:09:40,950 --> 01:09:39,520
means

1863
01:09:43,189 --> 01:09:40,960
wow do you have her number you said you

1864
01:09:44,630 --> 01:09:43,199
know what i know right like it's like

1865
01:09:47,430 --> 01:09:44,640
where's that woman now i could use that

1866
01:09:49,189 --> 01:09:47,440
woman right now but the whole you know i

1867
01:09:51,510 --> 01:09:49,199
i don't know i don't there are things

1868
01:09:53,749 --> 01:09:51,520
about this that i don't want to know and

1869
01:09:56,229 --> 01:09:53,759
i don't want to become

1870
01:09:57,189 --> 01:09:56,239
an expert on spots on human auras you

1871
01:09:58,630 --> 01:09:57,199
know but

1872
01:10:00,950 --> 01:09:58,640
but maybe that's the answer maybe

1873
01:10:02,550 --> 01:10:00,960
there's something about spot if you if

1874
01:10:05,030 --> 01:10:02,560
you researched enough about removal of

1875
01:10:06,709 --> 01:10:05,040
spots on human auras you could you could

1876
01:10:09,270 --> 01:10:06,719
to develop some next level of

1877
01:10:10,870 --> 01:10:09,280
understanding about uh ufo abductions

1878
01:10:11,590 --> 01:10:10,880
right i'll leave that for someone else

1879
01:10:13,830 --> 01:10:11,600
to

1880
01:10:16,470 --> 01:10:13,840
follow up uh it's just this whole thing

1881
01:10:17,990 --> 01:10:16,480
is so insane really it's so bizarre well

1882
01:10:19,590 --> 01:10:18,000
you know if i hadn't heard something

1883
01:10:21,590 --> 01:10:19,600
similar to that i would think is it

1884
01:10:23,990 --> 01:10:21,600
would be a little way out there but i

1885
01:10:26,229 --> 01:10:24,000
have heard uh actually something very

1886
01:10:28,550 --> 01:10:26,239
similar to that which is uh

1887
01:10:30,149 --> 01:10:28,560
quite quite amazing really now this

1888
01:10:32,470 --> 01:10:30,159
question here you've never said that

1889
01:10:34,870 --> 01:10:32,480
there's like living species

1890
01:10:36,790 --> 01:10:34,880
this person want to know how many uh

1891
01:10:38,630 --> 01:10:36,800
different species are currently live

1892
01:10:41,110 --> 01:10:38,640
underground we never really talked about

1893
01:10:41,910 --> 01:10:41,120
that um is that well

1894
01:10:44,310 --> 01:10:41,920
yeah

1895
01:10:46,070 --> 01:10:44,320
you know there are people that that get

1896
01:10:47,669 --> 01:10:46,080
into this um

1897
01:10:50,950 --> 01:10:47,679
sort of uh

1898
01:10:53,990 --> 01:10:50,960
how to even call this thing you know uh

1899
01:10:55,750 --> 01:10:54,000
where you're assigning specific names to

1900
01:10:58,310 --> 01:10:55,760
different types of aliens i mean this

1901
01:11:00,950 --> 01:10:58,320
has been done with ufos where there's

1902
01:11:02,470 --> 01:11:00,960
names for different shapes of craft

1903
01:11:04,950 --> 01:11:02,480
i think it's very interesting to look at

1904
01:11:07,350 --> 01:11:04,960
stuff from the early days of what we now

1905
01:11:08,229 --> 01:11:07,360
see kind of as formal ufology where you

1906
01:11:09,590 --> 01:11:08,239
had

1907
01:11:12,390 --> 01:11:09,600
people who were getting into the

1908
01:11:14,950 --> 01:11:12,400
taxonomy of the shapes looking at the

1909
01:11:16,790 --> 01:11:14,960
shapes trying to identify similarities

1910
01:11:18,709 --> 01:11:16,800
basically almost trying to figure out

1911
01:11:20,550 --> 01:11:18,719
like models of these things you know the

1912
01:11:21,990 --> 01:11:20,560
way that somebody might if you were

1913
01:11:23,669 --> 01:11:22,000
looking at cars

1914
01:11:27,189 --> 01:11:23,679
in a certain area find out what kind of

1915
01:11:28,390 --> 01:11:27,199
cars people drive and all of this stuff

1916
01:11:30,870 --> 01:11:28,400
has

1917
01:11:32,470 --> 01:11:30,880
basically i think resulted in more

1918
01:11:34,070 --> 01:11:32,480
questions and answers i don't think we

1919
01:11:36,790 --> 01:11:34,080
know any more

1920
01:11:39,270 --> 01:11:36,800
or or less about ufos if we could

1921
01:11:42,950 --> 01:11:39,280
categorize these entities as grays or

1922
01:11:45,750 --> 01:11:42,960
the mantis types or um you know

1923
01:11:47,590 --> 01:11:45,760
d rose that live underground right the

1924
01:11:50,870 --> 01:11:47,600
the shaver mystery stuff i mean it's

1925
01:11:53,350 --> 01:11:50,880
just there's so much lore

1926
01:11:54,950 --> 01:11:53,360
but it's and the lore can be fun i enjoy

1927
01:11:56,870 --> 01:11:54,960
talking about this stuff and i enjoy

1928
01:11:58,709 --> 01:11:56,880
thinking about it but at some point you

1929
01:12:01,110 --> 01:11:58,719
have to ask yourself

1930
01:12:04,070 --> 01:12:01,120
or you have to ask i guess in general

1931
01:12:07,110 --> 01:12:04,080
what's the reality here what is real

1932
01:12:08,470 --> 01:12:07,120
what is really going on and once you

1933
01:12:09,990 --> 01:12:08,480
enter that

1934
01:12:13,030 --> 01:12:10,000
realm

1935
01:12:15,189 --> 01:12:13,040
the uh all of the neatly tied up answers

1936
01:12:17,189 --> 01:12:15,199
just vanish and you're just left with

1937
01:12:20,070 --> 01:12:17,199
questions

1938
01:12:23,189 --> 01:12:20,080
yeah um i think sometimes we don't know

1939
01:12:25,910 --> 01:12:23,199
the right questions to ask um here's uh

1940
01:12:27,669 --> 01:12:25,920
here's an interesting question i also

1941
01:12:30,470 --> 01:12:27,679
thought about this too there has been

1942
01:12:32,070 --> 01:12:30,480
talk about crash retrieval

1943
01:12:34,630 --> 01:12:32,080
you know even

1944
01:12:37,189 --> 01:12:34,640
at the upper level supposedly people

1945
01:12:39,350 --> 01:12:37,199
have been talking about that uh but i um

1946
01:12:42,070 --> 01:12:39,360
that would that's just kind of another

1947
01:12:43,750 --> 01:12:42,080
thing along the line here but what about

1948
01:12:45,590 --> 01:12:43,760
um let's see belinda wanted to know what

1949
01:12:49,350 --> 01:12:45,600
about the high level of radioactivity

1950
01:12:51,350 --> 01:12:49,360
emerging from ufos at the landing sites

1951
01:12:53,669 --> 01:12:51,360
well there's um there are some great

1952
01:12:56,630 --> 01:12:53,679
documented cases of that i'm sure that

1953
01:12:59,510 --> 01:12:56,640
um people are familiar with the cash

1954
01:13:00,790 --> 01:12:59,520
landrum case where a person

1955
01:13:03,350 --> 01:13:00,800
was really

1956
01:13:04,790 --> 01:13:03,360
made gravely ill apparently by radiation

1957
01:13:09,270 --> 01:13:04,800
being emitted from one of these things

1958
01:13:14,870 --> 01:13:12,630
then again there are a lot of great ufo

1959
01:13:17,430 --> 01:13:14,880
landing cases where there was no radio

1960
01:13:20,470 --> 01:13:17,440
activity reported so

1961
01:13:22,870 --> 01:13:20,480
are some of these things spacecraft with

1962
01:13:25,430 --> 01:13:22,880
aliens in them that maybe use a

1963
01:13:27,030 --> 01:13:25,440
radioactive propulsion and then

1964
01:13:29,669 --> 01:13:27,040
maybe or are some of these things

1965
01:13:32,310 --> 01:13:29,679
government craft that have radiation

1966
01:13:34,310 --> 01:13:32,320
traces left behind

1967
01:13:35,990 --> 01:13:34,320
unfortunately

1968
01:13:36,950 --> 01:13:36,000
you know it would be great if we could

1969
01:13:37,910 --> 01:13:36,960
make

1970
01:13:40,470 --> 01:13:37,920
this

1971
01:13:42,870 --> 01:13:40,480
strong link a one-to-one

1972
01:13:45,510 --> 01:13:42,880
link where every time there is a ufo on

1973
01:13:47,510 --> 01:13:45,520
the ground every time a person

1974
01:13:49,910 --> 01:13:47,520
gets within a certain number of feet of

1975
01:13:51,910 --> 01:13:49,920
a landed ufo there's radiation effects

1976
01:13:53,030 --> 01:13:51,920
but that's not really how it works

1977
01:13:54,229 --> 01:13:53,040
so

1978
01:13:56,149 --> 01:13:54,239
um

1979
01:13:58,070 --> 01:13:56,159
you know so it's it's again there's

1980
01:14:00,070 --> 01:13:58,080
evidence there and i certainly think

1981
01:14:04,070 --> 01:14:00,080
that the radiation that's been detected

1982
01:14:06,229 --> 01:14:04,080
in some of these high profile cases

1983
01:14:08,709 --> 01:14:06,239
is a very strong indicator that there's

1984
01:14:11,350 --> 01:14:08,719
something going on here strong evidence

1985
01:14:14,229 --> 01:14:11,360
but it's not necessarily

1986
01:14:15,110 --> 01:14:14,239
proof of any one theory or another it's

1987
01:14:20,870 --> 01:14:15,120
just

1988
01:14:23,830 --> 01:14:20,880
doesn't really lead us to a final answer

1989
01:14:26,790 --> 01:14:23,840
yes i agree on that so let's jump right

1990
01:14:29,910 --> 01:14:26,800
into the bridgewater triangle

1991
01:14:32,709 --> 01:14:29,920
and for the person that has never heard

1992
01:14:34,790 --> 01:14:32,719
of it can you explain the geographical

1993
01:14:37,750 --> 01:14:34,800
area and then we'll get into

1994
01:14:39,350 --> 01:14:37,760
what happens uh what people are claiming

1995
01:14:42,630 --> 01:14:39,360
we touched on a little bit but i'd like

1996
01:14:45,270 --> 01:14:42,640
to talk on that more if we can

1997
01:14:47,510 --> 01:14:45,280
okay um basically the bridgewater

1998
01:14:50,149 --> 01:14:47,520
triangle is an area of southeastern

1999
01:14:54,709 --> 01:14:50,159
massachusetts that was rather strictly

2000
01:14:56,950 --> 01:14:54,719
defined by lauren coleman around 1978 as

2001
01:14:58,630 --> 01:14:56,960
an area of several hundred square miles

2002
01:15:00,870 --> 01:14:58,640
uh between

2003
01:15:04,149 --> 01:15:00,880
certain towns um

2004
01:15:05,430 --> 01:15:04,159
but i'm just gonna kind of say honestly

2005
01:15:07,510 --> 01:15:05,440
like

2006
01:15:09,350 --> 01:15:07,520
i appreciate that lauren coleman gave a

2007
01:15:11,750 --> 01:15:09,360
name to this thing and i appreciate that

2008
01:15:14,229 --> 01:15:11,760
he created some boundaries but i don't

2009
01:15:16,950 --> 01:15:14,239
necessarily think that the boundaries

2010
01:15:19,590 --> 01:15:16,960
that he drew are really the boundaries

2011
01:15:21,910 --> 01:15:19,600
of the area that we're talking about so

2012
01:15:23,990 --> 01:15:21,920
um i would kind of like to sort of get

2013
01:15:25,350 --> 01:15:24,000
away from that definition and sort of

2014
01:15:26,870 --> 01:15:25,360
propose my own definition that the

2015
01:15:29,430 --> 01:15:26,880
bridgewater triangle is an area of

2016
01:15:32,070 --> 01:15:29,440
southeastern massachusetts that centers

2017
01:15:34,390 --> 01:15:32,080
around a place called the hakkemok swamp

2018
01:15:37,910 --> 01:15:34,400
and radiates out from there the hakkamak

2019
01:15:40,229 --> 01:15:37,920
swamp is this massive massive wilderness

2020
01:15:42,070 --> 01:15:40,239
area that's really kind of unique it's

2021
01:15:43,910 --> 01:15:42,080
the largest one of the largest swamps of

2022
01:15:46,070 --> 01:15:43,920
its kind in the entire northeastern part

2023
01:15:47,830 --> 01:15:46,080
of the united states one of very few

2024
01:15:50,310 --> 01:15:47,840
places in massachusetts where there are

2025
01:15:52,149 --> 01:15:50,320
still old growth trees simply because

2026
01:15:55,270 --> 01:15:52,159
people were never able really to get in

2027
01:15:56,950 --> 01:15:55,280
there with machinery to cut them down

2028
01:15:58,870 --> 01:15:56,960
it's got billions and billions of

2029
01:15:59,669 --> 01:15:58,880
gallons of water flowing through it it's

2030
01:16:05,669 --> 01:15:59,679
this

2031
01:16:09,189 --> 01:16:05,679
diverse ecological

2032
01:16:11,030 --> 01:16:09,199
place and it's also sort of ground zero

2033
01:16:14,709 --> 01:16:11,040
for all kinds of

2034
01:16:17,270 --> 01:16:14,719
uh really weird stories um

2035
01:16:20,870 --> 01:16:17,280
where you know as mentioned the ufo

2036
01:16:22,550 --> 01:16:20,880
stuff bigfoot ghosts uh people seeing

2037
01:16:25,750 --> 01:16:22,560
aliens people

2038
01:16:28,149 --> 01:16:25,760
um you know having every kind of strange

2039
01:16:31,189 --> 01:16:28,159
encounter that you can think of satanic

2040
01:16:34,709 --> 01:16:31,199
cults and cattle mutilations and

2041
01:16:37,110 --> 01:16:34,719
um you know the whole gamut of of weird

2042
01:16:41,510 --> 01:16:37,120
experience that people can have yeah you

2043
01:16:43,830 --> 01:16:41,520
can see here um a map that kind of shows

2044
01:16:45,590 --> 01:16:43,840
where it is in massachusetts in general

2045
01:16:47,669 --> 01:16:45,600
but i think there are areas that are

2046
01:16:49,350 --> 01:16:47,679
adjacent to those triangular boundaries

2047
01:16:51,430 --> 01:16:49,360
that have a very high level of

2048
01:16:52,870 --> 01:16:51,440
paranormal activity and other areas that

2049
01:16:55,430 --> 01:16:52,880
are within them that have a very low

2050
01:16:57,510 --> 01:16:55,440
level and to to be clear for people this

2051
01:17:00,070 --> 01:16:57,520
is an area that uh outside of the

2052
01:17:01,910 --> 01:17:00,080
hakamak swamp there are rural areas but

2053
01:17:04,229 --> 01:17:01,920
there are also there's a city of taunton

2054
01:17:05,990 --> 01:17:04,239
in there there's very densely built up

2055
01:17:09,110 --> 01:17:06,000
suburban areas and there's a lot a lot

2056
01:17:11,270 --> 01:17:09,120
of people that live there um and so it's

2057
01:17:13,990 --> 01:17:11,280
not like you can just go there and

2058
01:17:16,950 --> 01:17:14,000
suddenly you're in some kind of uh

2059
01:17:18,790 --> 01:17:16,960
tv show twilight zone where um you know

2060
01:17:21,110 --> 01:17:18,800
bigfoot is chasing you and there's

2061
01:17:21,990 --> 01:17:21,120
there's lights in the sky you know but

2062
01:17:24,790 --> 01:17:22,000
um

2063
01:17:28,070 --> 01:17:24,800
there is this body of citing reports

2064
01:17:30,070 --> 01:17:28,080
that have taken place over time

2065
01:17:31,590 --> 01:17:30,080
um

2066
01:17:33,830 --> 01:17:31,600
there's definitely something going on

2067
01:17:36,149 --> 01:17:33,840
there i'm i'm convinced of it

2068
01:17:38,709 --> 01:17:36,159
right i do remember there was wasn't the

2069
01:17:40,870 --> 01:17:38,719
police involved in like investigating

2070
01:17:42,870 --> 01:17:40,880
satanic rituals there

2071
01:17:45,189 --> 01:17:42,880
there was one uh police officer in

2072
01:17:47,030 --> 01:17:45,199
particular alan alves who kind of

2073
01:17:50,790 --> 01:17:47,040
specialized in

2074
01:17:52,950 --> 01:17:50,800
investigating satanic stuff um

2075
01:17:55,189 --> 01:17:52,960
i think that's a very complex story the

2076
01:17:56,390 --> 01:17:55,199
the satanic stuff in particular where

2077
01:17:59,750 --> 01:17:56,400
you had

2078
01:18:02,470 --> 01:17:59,760
probably like real satanists who were

2079
01:18:05,590 --> 01:18:02,480
maybe harmless uh active in there in the

2080
01:18:08,149 --> 01:18:05,600
1980s and then you maybe had some

2081
01:18:10,709 --> 01:18:08,159
very dangerous uh people and and

2082
01:18:12,790 --> 01:18:10,719
criminals that were maybe adjacent to

2083
01:18:15,590 --> 01:18:12,800
the satanic stuff there was also the

2084
01:18:17,270 --> 01:18:15,600
whole satanic panic of the 80s which i

2085
01:18:19,590 --> 01:18:17,280
think we now realize that some of what

2086
01:18:21,910 --> 01:18:19,600
people were afraid of with regard to

2087
01:18:24,390 --> 01:18:21,920
satanism at that time wasn't real but

2088
01:18:25,830 --> 01:18:24,400
some of it was and certainly there were

2089
01:18:27,590 --> 01:18:25,840
there were murders that took place in

2090
01:18:30,470 --> 01:18:27,600
that area and there's somebody who's in

2091
01:18:32,950 --> 01:18:30,480
prison uh even today it's a it's a very

2092
01:18:35,510 --> 01:18:32,960
complex story

2093
01:18:38,070 --> 01:18:35,520
right and am i confusing this place

2094
01:18:39,030 --> 01:18:38,080
where there were lights that were seen

2095
01:18:41,590 --> 01:18:39,040
like

2096
01:18:43,590 --> 01:18:41,600
um on a path or something is that was

2097
01:18:45,750 --> 01:18:43,600
that also in the bridgewater oh

2098
01:18:47,030 --> 01:18:45,760
absolutely there are uh i think you're

2099
01:18:49,270 --> 01:18:47,040
probably thinking of a scene in the

2100
01:18:51,990 --> 01:18:49,280
bridgewater triangle documentary uh

2101
01:18:53,510 --> 01:18:52,000
where a witness describes seeing sort of

2102
01:18:55,510 --> 01:18:53,520
these orbs

2103
01:18:58,870 --> 01:18:55,520
that's it yeah over

2104
01:19:01,910 --> 01:18:58,880
a bridge in in bridgewater but there are

2105
01:19:04,950 --> 01:19:01,920
so many of these lights stories there

2106
01:19:08,229 --> 01:19:04,960
are so many of these orbs stories these

2107
01:19:10,070 --> 01:19:08,239
phantom uh glowing lights very commonly

2108
01:19:11,030 --> 01:19:10,080
reported in this region

2109
01:19:13,030 --> 01:19:11,040
um

2110
01:19:14,470 --> 01:19:13,040
and you know again

2111
01:19:16,390 --> 01:19:14,480
the area where

2112
01:19:19,030 --> 01:19:16,400
in the bridgewater triangle documentary

2113
01:19:22,709 --> 01:19:19,040
where that witness reported seeing

2114
01:19:26,229 --> 01:19:22,719
those orbs i had somebody report to me

2115
01:19:28,310 --> 01:19:26,239
relatively recently uh seeing uh

2116
01:19:30,950 --> 01:19:28,320
a structured craft type ufo right in

2117
01:19:32,310 --> 01:19:30,960
that same area you know so you and uh

2118
01:19:34,630 --> 01:19:32,320
additionally

2119
01:19:36,390 --> 01:19:34,640
there were uh there were sightings of

2120
01:19:38,630 --> 01:19:36,400
bigfoot side creatures right across the

2121
01:19:41,189 --> 01:19:38,640
street from there so you've got this

2122
01:19:42,070 --> 01:19:41,199
area that is smaller than a city block

2123
01:19:44,070 --> 01:19:42,080
where

2124
01:19:46,070 --> 01:19:44,080
around the same time in the same span of

2125
01:19:47,910 --> 01:19:46,080
years not on the same day or in the same

2126
01:19:49,990 --> 01:19:47,920
week but in the same years you could

2127
01:19:51,990 --> 01:19:50,000
have a structured craft type ufo

2128
01:19:54,390 --> 01:19:52,000
sightings or more than one sightings of

2129
01:19:56,310 --> 01:19:54,400
these orbs glowing lights uh close to

2130
01:19:58,709 --> 01:19:56,320
the surface of the ground seen at close

2131
01:20:00,390 --> 01:19:58,719
range and then uh people seeing bigfoot

2132
01:20:02,550 --> 01:20:00,400
creatures so it's like what what is

2133
01:20:05,510 --> 01:20:02,560
going on here

2134
01:20:08,149 --> 01:20:05,520
i got from what i understand it's like

2135
01:20:09,270 --> 01:20:08,159
the the heaviest area for the so-called

2136
01:20:10,550 --> 01:20:09,280
bigfoot

2137
01:20:11,990 --> 01:20:10,560
sightings

2138
01:20:14,229 --> 01:20:12,000
yeah there are there are some other

2139
01:20:15,430 --> 01:20:14,239
areas in uh in massachusetts and

2140
01:20:17,350 --> 01:20:15,440
elsewhere in new england where people

2141
01:20:19,030 --> 01:20:17,360
say that they see these things but there

2142
01:20:22,470 --> 01:20:19,040
certainly has been a very dense

2143
01:20:24,870 --> 01:20:22,480
concentration of bigfoot type sightings

2144
01:20:27,270 --> 01:20:24,880
in the bridgewater triangle dating back

2145
01:20:29,590 --> 01:20:27,280
to the early 1970s and and probably

2146
01:20:32,790 --> 01:20:29,600
older than that as well

2147
01:20:35,270 --> 01:20:32,800
earlier you mentioned that um near these

2148
01:20:36,709 --> 01:20:35,280
stone structures like there's that uh

2149
01:20:38,870 --> 01:20:36,719
that one i'm trying to think where it is

2150
01:20:41,030 --> 01:20:38,880
in massachusetts that's could be very

2151
01:20:43,110 --> 01:20:41,040
early there's a lot going on in that one

2152
01:20:45,750 --> 01:20:43,120
underground little like stone structures

2153
01:20:47,189 --> 01:20:45,760
and things what's it called

2154
01:20:48,550 --> 01:20:47,199
you're thinking about the stone chamber

2155
01:20:49,430 --> 01:20:48,560
in like uh

2156
01:20:51,510 --> 01:20:49,440
yeah

2157
01:20:53,110 --> 01:20:51,520
it's starting to massachusetts new

2158
01:20:54,470 --> 01:20:53,120
england stonehenge i think they call it

2159
01:20:55,669 --> 01:20:54,480
or something oh america stonehenge in

2160
01:20:56,629 --> 01:20:55,679
north salem new hampshire it's in new

2161
01:20:58,390 --> 01:20:56,639
hampshire

2162
01:21:00,470 --> 01:20:58,400
it's just over the line

2163
01:21:01,990 --> 01:21:00,480
yeah uh that place is great i would

2164
01:21:03,830 --> 01:21:02,000
encourage people to go there and check

2165
01:21:05,750 --> 01:21:03,840
it out that's actually how

2166
01:21:07,669 --> 01:21:05,760
um i kind of got interested in this

2167
01:21:10,070 --> 01:21:07,679
subject when i was a child i watched an

2168
01:21:11,669 --> 01:21:10,080
episode of the 1970s tv show in search

2169
01:21:13,590 --> 01:21:11,679
of that talked about america's

2170
01:21:15,990 --> 01:21:13,600
stonehenge and i went there when i was a

2171
01:21:19,510 --> 01:21:16,000
teenager was absolutely fascinated about

2172
01:21:21,430 --> 01:21:19,520
it um and knewing uh america's

2173
01:21:23,110 --> 01:21:21,440
stonehenge

2174
01:21:24,470 --> 01:21:23,120
it's it's a really interesting place

2175
01:21:25,990 --> 01:21:24,480
there's a lot to learn there there's a

2176
01:21:27,590 --> 01:21:26,000
lot to see there's also a lot of

2177
01:21:29,030 --> 01:21:27,600
questions there's there's understanding

2178
01:21:31,350 --> 01:21:29,040
that a lot of the stonework there was

2179
01:21:34,229 --> 01:21:31,360
moved around in the 19th century and

2180
01:21:36,709 --> 01:21:34,239
later as well and people who maybe

2181
01:21:37,830 --> 01:21:36,719
excavated there um

2182
01:21:39,510 --> 01:21:37,840
some of those people might have done

2183
01:21:41,669 --> 01:21:39,520
more harm than good building things that

2184
01:21:44,149 --> 01:21:41,679
they thought were there based on their

2185
01:21:46,790 --> 01:21:44,159
ideas that this stuff was built by irish

2186
01:21:50,149 --> 01:21:46,800
monks in the year 1000 or whatever it

2187
01:21:52,870 --> 01:21:50,159
was but there are very very many similar

2188
01:21:56,149 --> 01:21:52,880
places in massachusetts and elsewhere in

2189
01:21:59,350 --> 01:21:56,159
new england where you can see these

2190
01:22:01,669 --> 01:21:59,360
underground stone chambers or other

2191
01:22:03,430 --> 01:22:01,679
enigmatic stone structures that that i

2192
01:22:05,430 --> 01:22:03,440
believe were built by prehistoric native

2193
01:22:09,110 --> 01:22:05,440
americans i've become really interested

2194
01:22:11,110 --> 01:22:09,120
in archaeology and in

2195
01:22:13,669 --> 01:22:11,120
the story of the people that were here

2196
01:22:15,910 --> 01:22:13,679
before the colonists arrived in the 10

2197
01:22:17,110 --> 01:22:15,920
000 years about which we really know

2198
01:22:18,229 --> 01:22:17,120
very little

2199
01:22:20,470 --> 01:22:18,239
and

2200
01:22:22,310 --> 01:22:20,480
there's been a lot of focus on that with

2201
01:22:25,270 --> 01:22:22,320
regard to the bridgewater triangle and

2202
01:22:26,229 --> 01:22:25,280
some of that i think is totally valid

2203
01:22:27,910 --> 01:22:26,239
because

2204
01:22:30,470 --> 01:22:27,920
there are areas

2205
01:22:31,910 --> 01:22:30,480
uh in and adjacent to the bridgewater

2206
01:22:34,070 --> 01:22:31,920
triangle

2207
01:22:35,990 --> 01:22:34,080
where there were as many people living

2208
01:22:38,149 --> 01:22:36,000
there five thousand years ago as there

2209
01:22:40,390 --> 01:22:38,159
are now some of these places were among

2210
01:22:42,629 --> 01:22:40,400
the most densely habited

2211
01:22:44,709 --> 01:22:42,639
um areas in the northeastern part of

2212
01:22:47,110 --> 01:22:44,719
what is now the united states hundreds

2213
01:22:48,709 --> 01:22:47,120
or thousands of years ago and and i

2214
01:22:50,550 --> 01:22:48,719
think that that

2215
01:22:52,950 --> 01:22:50,560
is something that is worth looking at

2216
01:22:54,629 --> 01:22:52,960
when it comes to the paranormal stuff

2217
01:22:57,430 --> 01:22:54,639
but unfortunately i think a lot of

2218
01:23:00,950 --> 01:22:57,440
attention goes to king philip's war

2219
01:23:03,350 --> 01:23:00,960
which was a conflict between

2220
01:23:06,550 --> 01:23:03,360
the colonists and some native groups

2221
01:23:08,070 --> 01:23:06,560
against other native groups in 1675 in

2222
01:23:10,470 --> 01:23:08,080
1676

2223
01:23:13,830 --> 01:23:10,480
it was a very bloody war that wound up

2224
01:23:16,149 --> 01:23:13,840
basically spelling the end

2225
01:23:18,390 --> 01:23:16,159
for people who lived in massachusetts of

2226
01:23:19,750 --> 01:23:18,400
a life way that had existed for for

2227
01:23:21,750 --> 01:23:19,760
thousands of years

2228
01:23:23,910 --> 01:23:21,760
and so people look at that time and

2229
01:23:25,750 --> 01:23:23,920
think okay well um there were maybe

2230
01:23:28,790 --> 01:23:25,760
battles in the area the bridgewater

2231
01:23:30,629 --> 01:23:28,800
triangle there was a genocide that

2232
01:23:32,390 --> 01:23:30,639
happened um

2233
01:23:35,430 --> 01:23:32,400
this may

2234
01:23:37,030 --> 01:23:35,440
have a bearing on the ufo stuff but i

2235
01:23:39,590 --> 01:23:37,040
think it's important to remember that

2236
01:23:41,350 --> 01:23:39,600
there were there were 10 000 years and

2237
01:23:43,110 --> 01:23:41,360
in those years there were population

2238
01:23:45,510 --> 01:23:43,120
collapses we know this from the

2239
01:23:47,189 --> 01:23:45,520
archaeological record where it went from

2240
01:23:50,149 --> 01:23:47,199
being very densely settled to nobody

2241
01:23:52,390 --> 01:23:50,159
living there anymore at certain times um

2242
01:23:54,310 --> 01:23:52,400
and there must have been wars and there

2243
01:23:56,229 --> 01:23:54,320
must have been famines and there must

2244
01:23:58,629 --> 01:23:56,239
have been all of the horrible things and

2245
01:24:01,189 --> 01:23:58,639
all the good things that human beings do

2246
01:24:03,430 --> 01:24:01,199
in their in their cultures

2247
01:24:04,550 --> 01:24:03,440
and so we just don't know you know it's

2248
01:24:05,910 --> 01:24:04,560
uh

2249
01:24:07,990 --> 01:24:05,920
it's certainly something something

2250
01:24:09,350 --> 01:24:08,000
interesting to look at but

2251
01:24:10,950 --> 01:24:09,360
right you know i don't i don't know that

2252
01:24:12,950 --> 01:24:10,960
we can make a link between that and the

2253
01:24:14,709 --> 01:24:12,960
paranormal stuff really

2254
01:24:17,510 --> 01:24:14,719
yes and another thing that kind of

2255
01:24:19,270 --> 01:24:17,520
fascinates me on all that too is if you

2256
01:24:21,910 --> 01:24:19,280
think about the ice age

2257
01:24:23,990 --> 01:24:21,920
how could you know maybe there was uh

2258
01:24:26,310 --> 01:24:24,000
maybe there was a settle you know

2259
01:24:28,790 --> 01:24:26,320
settlements long before the ice age 20

2260
01:24:30,950 --> 01:24:28,800
000 years ago that were wiped out during

2261
01:24:33,189 --> 01:24:30,960
the ice age and and you know and maybe

2262
01:24:34,790 --> 01:24:33,199
that's why we only have records in the

2263
01:24:37,430 --> 01:24:34,800
new england area

2264
01:24:38,790 --> 01:24:37,440
of uh you know 14 000 years i believe it

2265
01:24:42,070 --> 01:24:38,800
is something like that

2266
01:24:44,629 --> 01:24:42,080
um of of beings here and they say you

2267
01:24:45,430 --> 01:24:44,639
know possibly came over from

2268
01:24:46,950 --> 01:24:45,440
uh

2269
01:24:49,350 --> 01:24:46,960
i forget the

2270
01:24:51,990 --> 01:24:49,360
exactly the land mass however they

2271
01:24:54,149 --> 01:24:52,000
got here um perhaps uh we just don't

2272
01:24:55,990 --> 01:24:54,159
know a lot about our real our history

2273
01:24:57,110 --> 01:24:56,000
when it goes back much further than 10

2274
01:24:58,709 --> 01:24:57,120
000 years

2275
01:25:00,470 --> 01:24:58,719
you really don't know much

2276
01:25:02,229 --> 01:25:00,480
you can find books that were written

2277
01:25:04,870 --> 01:25:02,239
within human memory you know a few

2278
01:25:07,110 --> 01:25:04,880
generations ago saying that uh native

2279
01:25:08,950 --> 01:25:07,120
americans arrived in new england 3000

2280
01:25:10,390 --> 01:25:08,960
years ago and that number has been

2281
01:25:12,790 --> 01:25:10,400
pushed back and pushed back and pushed

2282
01:25:15,430 --> 01:25:12,800
back and now it's at 14 000 years but i

2283
01:25:16,709 --> 01:25:15,440
believe that even that is far too soon i

2284
01:25:21,669 --> 01:25:16,719
think that

2285
01:25:22,870 --> 01:25:21,679
archaeology will yield information that

2286
01:25:24,550 --> 01:25:22,880
people have been here for tens of

2287
01:25:27,270 --> 01:25:24,560
thousands of years

2288
01:25:30,390 --> 01:25:27,280
i do i do amateur archaeology as a hobby

2289
01:25:32,709 --> 01:25:30,400
i do uh surface collecting of native

2290
01:25:34,870 --> 01:25:32,719
american artifacts so it's

2291
01:25:38,550 --> 01:25:34,880
on private property with permission

2292
01:25:40,149 --> 01:25:38,560
i study these stone tools and i learn

2293
01:25:43,030 --> 01:25:40,159
from them about the life ways of the

2294
01:25:45,669 --> 01:25:43,040
people that lived here in the past

2295
01:25:48,149 --> 01:25:45,679
and i correspond with other people who

2296
01:25:51,030 --> 01:25:48,159
do the same thing in in other spots

2297
01:25:53,669 --> 01:25:51,040
and the spots where i find stone tools

2298
01:25:56,070 --> 01:25:53,679
the ages of those stone tools range from

2299
01:25:58,470 --> 01:25:56,080
maybe a thousand years old to

2300
01:26:00,149 --> 01:25:58,480
seven or eight thousand years old but i

2301
01:26:02,790 --> 01:26:00,159
know people who have other spots that

2302
01:26:03,910 --> 01:26:02,800
are still older and i know other people

2303
01:26:06,950 --> 01:26:03,920
who

2304
01:26:10,070 --> 01:26:06,960
find what certainly appear to be stone

2305
01:26:11,669 --> 01:26:10,080
tools with wear on them

2306
01:26:13,990 --> 01:26:11,679
uh in

2307
01:26:16,229 --> 01:26:14,000
deposits that were left behind when the

2308
01:26:18,709 --> 01:26:16,239
glacier receded suggesting that these

2309
01:26:20,070 --> 01:26:18,719
things pre-date the glacier predate the

2310
01:26:21,669 --> 01:26:20,080
ice age

2311
01:26:23,110 --> 01:26:21,679
i would think so i would think that's

2312
01:26:26,550 --> 01:26:23,120
very possible

2313
01:26:28,550 --> 01:26:26,560
yeah when i was a little kid in maine a

2314
01:26:30,470 --> 01:26:28,560
friend of mine and and i were running

2315
01:26:31,990 --> 01:26:30,480
through a field and he tripped and i

2316
01:26:33,430 --> 01:26:32,000
don't know why he even thought to do

2317
01:26:35,830 --> 01:26:33,440
this but he went back to see what he

2318
01:26:38,390 --> 01:26:35,840
tripped on and it ended up being a a

2319
01:26:40,470 --> 01:26:38,400
stone axe axe head

2320
01:26:42,470 --> 01:26:40,480
and he sent it off to the university of

2321
01:26:44,310 --> 01:26:42,480
uh new hampshire to have him you know

2322
01:26:46,070 --> 01:26:44,320
they said it was indeed you know an

2323
01:26:48,149 --> 01:26:46,080
early stone hit

2324
01:26:49,990 --> 01:26:48,159
a stone accident

2325
01:26:52,149 --> 01:26:50,000
here's a question i was thinking about

2326
01:26:54,950 --> 01:26:52,159
in my mind but i almost didn't dare to

2327
01:26:56,229 --> 01:26:54,960
ask it uh diane asked this question were

2328
01:26:58,070 --> 01:26:56,239
you concerned about negative

2329
01:27:00,709 --> 01:26:58,080
repercussions from speaking about this

2330
01:27:02,310 --> 01:27:00,719
topic tonight i was thinking about that

2331
01:27:09,990 --> 01:27:02,320
yes i am

2332
01:27:13,270 --> 01:27:11,270
you know i'm concerned about negative

2333
01:27:16,070 --> 01:27:13,280
repercussions for you and for everybody

2334
01:27:17,669 --> 01:27:16,080
listening to this because um

2335
01:27:19,830 --> 01:27:17,679
there have been there have been

2336
01:27:21,270 --> 01:27:19,840
absolutely times

2337
01:27:24,709 --> 01:27:21,280
when i have

2338
01:27:26,790 --> 01:27:24,719
um confided in people years ago

2339
01:27:29,669 --> 01:27:26,800
about things that happened to me and

2340
01:27:31,189 --> 01:27:29,679
then the next day a phone call from them

2341
01:27:32,070 --> 01:27:31,199
and they'd say hey chris

2342
01:27:33,350 --> 01:27:32,080
you're never going to believe what

2343
01:27:34,790 --> 01:27:33,360
happened to me last night but i felt

2344
01:27:36,070 --> 01:27:34,800
like there was something in my room or

2345
01:27:37,270 --> 01:27:36,080
something like that and i'm not talking

2346
01:27:39,669 --> 01:27:37,280
about

2347
01:27:41,910 --> 01:27:39,679
people that i knew who were

2348
01:27:44,229 --> 01:27:41,920
prone to flights of fancy i'm talking

2349
01:27:46,950 --> 01:27:44,239
about like people that i knew who viewed

2350
01:27:48,870 --> 01:27:46,960
themselves as uh macho you know

2351
01:27:51,750 --> 01:27:48,880
masculine figures who

2352
01:27:52,790 --> 01:27:51,760
expressed fear after something happens

2353
01:27:57,189 --> 01:27:52,800
to them

2354
01:28:00,709 --> 01:27:57,199
is a fact that i didn't talk about this

2355
01:28:02,709 --> 01:28:00,719
with anybody for a span of close to 10

2356
01:28:03,910 --> 01:28:02,719
years of my life

2357
01:28:05,830 --> 01:28:03,920
you know there was

2358
01:28:07,510 --> 01:28:05,840
there was a time when i just swore off

2359
01:28:11,590 --> 01:28:07,520
talking about this stuff

2360
01:28:13,590 --> 01:28:11,600
altogether um but eventually i

2361
01:28:15,830 --> 01:28:13,600
finally sort of came up with that okay

2362
01:28:17,669 --> 01:28:15,840
well if i just look at this stuff as

2363
01:28:19,830 --> 01:28:17,679
sort of a folklore stuff if i just

2364
01:28:22,390 --> 01:28:19,840
collect these stories i can still

2365
01:28:23,270 --> 01:28:22,400
participate in all of this i can still

2366
01:28:25,590 --> 01:28:23,280
um

2367
01:28:27,750 --> 01:28:25,600
speculate about this with people and you

2368
01:28:30,470 --> 01:28:27,760
know enjoy the aspects of this that i

2369
01:28:32,470 --> 01:28:30,480
enjoy the what-if aspects and

2370
01:28:36,229 --> 01:28:32,480
you know but

2371
01:28:38,790 --> 01:28:36,239
i i am leery about discussing the

2372
01:28:40,709 --> 01:28:38,800
reality of my you know findings and

2373
01:28:42,470 --> 01:28:40,719
certainly i could i could come out a

2374
01:28:44,149 --> 01:28:42,480
program like this and you and i could

2375
01:28:46,629 --> 01:28:44,159
just have a talk about

2376
01:28:48,149 --> 01:28:46,639
um oh you know aliens ancient aliens are

2377
01:28:49,830 --> 01:28:48,159
they real you know or like stuff i've

2378
01:28:52,310 --> 01:28:49,840
done on tv before

2379
01:28:54,470 --> 01:28:52,320
um i like all that stuff it's fun you

2380
01:28:56,310 --> 01:28:54,480
know but i had kind of resolved when

2381
01:28:58,070 --> 01:28:56,320
when you asked me to come on the podcast

2382
01:29:00,629 --> 01:28:58,080
that if i was going to come on

2383
01:29:02,709 --> 01:29:00,639
i was going to be honest and

2384
01:29:04,629 --> 01:29:02,719
tell people what i really

2385
01:29:07,189 --> 01:29:04,639
what my conclusions are and people are

2386
01:29:08,390 --> 01:29:07,199
free to to totally dismiss everything

2387
01:29:09,830 --> 01:29:08,400
that i'm saying and it doesn't hurt my

2388
01:29:11,910 --> 01:29:09,840
feelings at all because i can't prove

2389
01:29:15,030 --> 01:29:11,920
any of it and i and i know how crazy it

2390
01:29:16,390 --> 01:29:15,040
sounds but that is you know for people

2391
01:29:18,790 --> 01:29:16,400
out there who

2392
01:29:20,790 --> 01:29:18,800
i think are really trying to get some

2393
01:29:22,790 --> 01:29:20,800
insight into this this is the insight

2394
01:29:23,669 --> 01:29:22,800
that i can maybe

2395
01:29:27,350 --> 01:29:23,679
give

2396
01:29:29,669 --> 01:29:27,360
something to think about or an alley to

2397
01:29:32,149 --> 01:29:29,679
look at but but like i say be careful

2398
01:29:33,990 --> 01:29:32,159
you know it is dangerous it is negative

2399
01:29:36,950 --> 01:29:34,000
it is harmful i don't think that there

2400
01:29:39,750 --> 01:29:36,960
is going to be an answer and uh the

2401
01:29:40,950 --> 01:29:39,760
closer you get to whatever it is

2402
01:29:45,830 --> 01:29:40,960
the more

2403
01:29:47,990 --> 01:29:45,840
yeah well that's

2404
01:29:50,070 --> 01:29:48,000
we're going to stay in touch okay

2405
01:29:52,709 --> 01:29:50,080
sure i want to let you know yeah

2406
01:29:55,910 --> 01:29:52,719
yeah i i definitely will uh the lines

2407
01:29:57,669 --> 01:29:55,920
are open and bill is standing by uh to

2408
01:30:00,470 --> 01:29:57,679
screen your call and remember when you

2409
01:30:01,990 --> 01:30:00,480
call in you have to mute your uh your

2410
01:30:04,470 --> 01:30:02,000
media whatever you're listening to the

2411
01:30:09,430 --> 01:30:04,480
show on that number is up on the screen

2412
01:30:13,910 --> 01:30:11,510
i see dave's in the chat hi dave thanks

2413
01:30:17,590 --> 01:30:13,920
for doing that um so yeah bill is

2414
01:30:19,590 --> 01:30:17,600
standing by uh so the line is open and

2415
01:30:23,030 --> 01:30:19,600
i'm sure we should get some calls after

2416
01:30:25,510 --> 01:30:23,040
all these messages came in and

2417
01:30:28,070 --> 01:30:25,520
um no this so this whole thing is

2418
01:30:30,390 --> 01:30:28,080
fascinating this whole thing about

2419
01:30:32,470 --> 01:30:30,400
um your thoughts on it and

2420
01:30:34,709 --> 01:30:32,480
i love archaeology myself too i mean

2421
01:30:37,189 --> 01:30:34,719
this is uh uh i might want to hang out

2422
01:30:38,950 --> 01:30:37,199
with you and maybe we'll both get

2423
01:30:41,110 --> 01:30:38,960
run over or something

2424
01:30:43,189 --> 01:30:41,120
by a minute where you live where you

2425
01:30:45,510 --> 01:30:43,199
live there's a lot of stuff to study and

2426
01:30:47,110 --> 01:30:45,520
to find and uh we could go out and look

2427
01:30:48,790 --> 01:30:47,120
at that stuff certainly

2428
01:30:50,470 --> 01:30:48,800
now there isn't there a tower did i hear

2429
01:30:53,189 --> 01:30:50,480
about a tower somewhere

2430
01:30:55,350 --> 01:30:53,199
stone tower in newport maybe that's

2431
01:30:57,510 --> 01:30:55,360
right that's in newport

2432
01:30:59,270 --> 01:30:57,520
that probably was built in the 17th

2433
01:31:00,870 --> 01:30:59,280
century

2434
01:31:03,189 --> 01:31:00,880
it's that's another one of these there

2435
01:31:04,870 --> 01:31:03,199
are so many of these and

2436
01:31:07,110 --> 01:31:04,880
you know this is kind of tangential to

2437
01:31:09,910 --> 01:31:07,120
to the ufo stuff right but there are so

2438
01:31:11,270 --> 01:31:09,920
many enigmas with stonework in

2439
01:31:13,590 --> 01:31:11,280
um

2440
01:31:15,430 --> 01:31:13,600
in massachusetts and when i when i took

2441
01:31:17,189 --> 01:31:15,440
a big step back away from ufo

2442
01:31:18,310 --> 01:31:17,199
investigation because it had become too

2443
01:31:21,110 --> 01:31:18,320
frightening

2444
01:31:23,270 --> 01:31:21,120
i um i really dove headfirst into the

2445
01:31:26,629 --> 01:31:23,280
archaeological mystery stuff

2446
01:31:28,870 --> 01:31:26,639
it it had kind of the mysterious aspect

2447
01:31:29,669 --> 01:31:28,880
that ufos had it had maybe the promise

2448
01:31:31,350 --> 01:31:29,679
of

2449
01:31:34,870 --> 01:31:31,360
finding out something that no one else

2450
01:31:37,510 --> 01:31:34,880
had been able to find out um but a a big

2451
01:31:39,590 --> 01:31:37,520
difference was was that a uh a stone

2452
01:31:43,030 --> 01:31:39,600
chamber was still going to be there the

2453
01:31:44,709 --> 01:31:43,040
next day and uh you know the ufo stuff

2454
01:31:46,470 --> 01:31:44,719
was uh

2455
01:31:47,270 --> 01:31:46,480
didn't have that kind of repeatability

2456
01:31:54,149 --> 01:31:47,280
right

2457
01:31:56,310 --> 01:31:54,159
it has been all along we have john uh

2458
01:31:59,270 --> 01:31:56,320
from new mexico it's on the line john

2459
01:32:00,550 --> 01:31:59,280
you are live on the air

2460
01:32:03,669 --> 01:32:00,560
hi how are you

2461
01:32:06,149 --> 01:32:03,679
hi welcome to the show

2462
01:32:08,229 --> 01:32:06,159
hey it's an honor to speak with you and

2463
01:32:09,669 --> 01:32:08,239
uh talk with you guys and

2464
01:32:10,870 --> 01:32:09,679
i'm pretty excited i've been watching

2465
01:32:13,110 --> 01:32:10,880
your show and

2466
01:32:15,270 --> 01:32:13,120
listening to it a lot and

2467
01:32:16,390 --> 01:32:15,280
i'm all about it

2468
01:32:18,550 --> 01:32:16,400
thank you i have a question for our

2469
01:32:21,270 --> 01:32:18,560
guest tonight

2470
01:32:22,790 --> 01:32:21,280
yeah um it's um hopefully it has

2471
01:32:24,870 --> 01:32:22,800
something to do with what you were just

2472
01:32:27,830 --> 01:32:24,880
talking about what do you think about

2473
01:32:28,709 --> 01:32:27,840
underground bases

2474
01:32:30,470 --> 01:32:28,719
well

2475
01:32:32,229 --> 01:32:30,480
that that's a good question and i i

2476
01:32:35,270 --> 01:32:32,239
wouldn't rule out the possibility of

2477
01:32:37,830 --> 01:32:35,280
something like an underground base um

2478
01:32:40,229 --> 01:32:37,840
there's a book called silent invasion by

2479
01:32:43,510 --> 01:32:40,239
ellen crystal it's one of the best books

2480
01:32:46,550 --> 01:32:43,520
that i ever read about ufos and in this

2481
01:32:49,030 --> 01:32:46,560
book she's discussing a wave of ufo

2482
01:32:51,350 --> 01:32:49,040
sightings in pine bush new york

2483
01:32:54,870 --> 01:32:51,360
and there is this this kind of

2484
01:32:57,189 --> 01:32:54,880
undercurrent of okay there seems to be

2485
01:32:59,430 --> 01:32:57,199
a bunch of ufos seen entering and

2486
01:33:01,830 --> 01:32:59,440
exiting the ground and there are areas

2487
01:33:03,990 --> 01:33:01,840
that seem to mysteriously be off limits

2488
01:33:06,229 --> 01:33:04,000
and that are that are connected to this

2489
01:33:09,350 --> 01:33:06,239
ufo stuff um

2490
01:33:11,510 --> 01:33:09,360
do i think that there is literally a

2491
01:33:13,750 --> 01:33:11,520
hollow space underneath the surface of

2492
01:33:16,149 --> 01:33:13,760
the earth somewhere in north america

2493
01:33:18,149 --> 01:33:16,159
where there's ufos and hangars

2494
01:33:21,189 --> 01:33:18,159
i'm inclined to say i don't think that's

2495
01:33:24,149 --> 01:33:21,199
the case i i don't know if it's the case

2496
01:33:25,830 --> 01:33:24,159
um but i do think that

2497
01:33:27,669 --> 01:33:25,840
for there is a

2498
01:33:29,750 --> 01:33:27,679
there is like a connection between ufo

2499
01:33:31,669 --> 01:33:29,760
sightings and and the underground and

2500
01:33:33,669 --> 01:33:31,679
openings in the ground and and the

2501
01:33:36,950 --> 01:33:33,679
openings in the grounds do

2502
01:33:39,030 --> 01:33:36,960
um have a connection with uh prehistoric

2503
01:33:39,910 --> 01:33:39,040
native american ethnography too where

2504
01:33:41,990 --> 01:33:39,920
they

2505
01:33:44,950 --> 01:33:42,000
seem to have venerated these places or

2506
01:33:46,950 --> 01:33:44,960
regarded them as special places um

2507
01:33:47,990 --> 01:33:46,960
you know there is

2508
01:33:50,229 --> 01:33:48,000
there is

2509
01:33:53,590 --> 01:33:50,239
kind of a interplay here between like

2510
01:33:56,870 --> 01:33:53,600
reality and folklore and myth and and

2511
01:33:59,189 --> 01:33:56,880
the possibility that some folklores and

2512
01:34:01,590 --> 01:33:59,199
myths are based on things that take

2513
01:34:04,229 --> 01:34:01,600
place in objective reality and that that

2514
01:34:05,590 --> 01:34:04,239
has a connection to ufo sightings um

2515
01:34:07,590 --> 01:34:05,600
there are

2516
01:34:09,669 --> 01:34:07,600
parallels between

2517
01:34:11,910 --> 01:34:09,679
european myths of little people and

2518
01:34:13,430 --> 01:34:11,920
fairies and and what would happen to

2519
01:34:15,350 --> 01:34:13,440
people if they got captured by the

2520
01:34:17,270 --> 01:34:15,360
fairies um

2521
01:34:18,390 --> 01:34:17,280
there are parallels between that and and

2522
01:34:20,310 --> 01:34:18,400
people who say that they've been

2523
01:34:22,390 --> 01:34:20,320
abducted by aliens and what happened to

2524
01:34:24,870 --> 01:34:22,400
them when they were on board the ufos

2525
01:34:27,990 --> 01:34:24,880
and these parallels are are remarkable

2526
01:34:29,430 --> 01:34:28,000
and they're compelling and um you know

2527
01:34:32,229 --> 01:34:29,440
it's it's just

2528
01:34:32,950 --> 01:34:32,239
you get into these aspects of ufo study

2529
01:34:34,950 --> 01:34:32,960
and

2530
01:34:36,550 --> 01:34:34,960
i think i just probably like lose a lot

2531
01:34:37,750 --> 01:34:36,560
of people right with this crazy stuff

2532
01:34:39,750 --> 01:34:37,760
but

2533
01:34:41,750 --> 01:34:39,760
it's just uh

2534
01:34:45,030 --> 01:34:41,760
you know i hate to repeat myself but

2535
01:34:48,550 --> 01:34:47,510
no it's it's interesting and

2536
01:34:51,590 --> 01:34:48,560
and i

2537
01:34:53,109 --> 01:34:51,600
it's it's not something to be discounted

2538
01:34:55,830 --> 01:34:53,119
you know like

2539
01:34:57,030 --> 01:34:55,840
like the farther i guess down the rabbit

2540
01:34:59,830 --> 01:34:57,040
hole you go

2541
01:35:01,830 --> 01:34:59,840
the more out there things can seem but

2542
01:35:03,270 --> 01:35:01,840
the more interconnected they can be as

2543
01:35:04,390 --> 01:35:03,280
well

2544
01:35:05,830 --> 01:35:04,400
and um

2545
01:35:08,709 --> 01:35:05,840
no i think that's cool that you said

2546
01:35:11,030 --> 01:35:08,719
about the ancient caves and

2547
01:35:12,950 --> 01:35:11,040
possibly modern caves and

2548
01:35:15,189 --> 01:35:12,960
and all that stuff because i've heard

2549
01:35:17,109 --> 01:35:15,199
about things like that too i mean i'm

2550
01:35:19,910 --> 01:35:17,119
i'm in the area of northern new mexico

2551
01:35:22,390 --> 01:35:19,920
kind of by los alamos and i grew up out

2552
01:35:23,990 --> 01:35:22,400
here and there's a lot of

2553
01:35:26,149 --> 01:35:24,000
i guess you could say folklore it's a

2554
01:35:29,270 --> 01:35:26,159
part of the it's a part of the culture

2555
01:35:32,390 --> 01:35:29,280
out here um ufos and everything

2556
01:35:33,910 --> 01:35:32,400
and i've always been fascinated by why

2557
01:35:36,390 --> 01:35:33,920
that is

2558
01:35:39,350 --> 01:35:36,400
and how it's kind of interconnected with

2559
01:35:42,310 --> 01:35:39,360
you know the manhattan project and

2560
01:35:43,990 --> 01:35:42,320
and everything else and it's all i find

2561
01:35:44,870 --> 01:35:44,000
really interesting but like you've also

2562
01:35:47,189 --> 01:35:44,880
said

2563
01:35:49,750 --> 01:35:47,199
sometimes when you get too close

2564
01:35:51,270 --> 01:35:49,760
it's not so fun anymore and it can get

2565
01:35:52,870 --> 01:35:51,280
pretty real

2566
01:35:55,510 --> 01:35:52,880
sure

2567
01:35:58,070 --> 01:35:55,520
so it's good to be careful too because

2568
01:35:59,669 --> 01:35:58,080
it isn't a joke in a lot of aspects if

2569
01:36:01,750 --> 01:35:59,679
you get

2570
01:36:02,950 --> 01:36:01,760
close to certain situations like people

2571
01:36:04,070 --> 01:36:02,960
won't talk

2572
01:36:08,870 --> 01:36:04,080
and

2573
01:36:10,950 --> 01:36:08,880
they won't say

2574
01:36:12,870 --> 01:36:10,960
and may know other people and

2575
01:36:15,030 --> 01:36:12,880
that's when it starts to get a little

2576
01:36:17,189 --> 01:36:15,040
you got to be careful i guess but

2577
01:36:19,910 --> 01:36:17,199
i've always found it to be really really

2578
01:36:21,350 --> 01:36:19,920
fascinating and amazing and

2579
01:36:22,950 --> 01:36:21,360
interesting

2580
01:36:24,390 --> 01:36:22,960
i think you're making some great points

2581
01:36:26,470 --> 01:36:24,400
there i like the

2582
01:36:28,629 --> 01:36:26,480
um i like you know kind of what you're

2583
01:36:29,990 --> 01:36:28,639
saying about this sort of rabbit hole

2584
01:36:31,830 --> 01:36:30,000
that you can go down where you're

2585
01:36:35,030 --> 01:36:31,840
getting into more and more

2586
01:36:36,629 --> 01:36:35,040
esoteric stuff and um people will i

2587
01:36:39,270 --> 01:36:36,639
think some people will maybe want to

2588
01:36:41,830 --> 01:36:39,280
push back against that and and discount

2589
01:36:43,270 --> 01:36:41,840
these really kind of far out ideas but i

2590
01:36:44,709 --> 01:36:43,280
i would kind of put it to people this

2591
01:36:46,870 --> 01:36:44,719
way where it's like

2592
01:36:48,229 --> 01:36:46,880
okay it's it's easy to envision aliens

2593
01:36:49,669 --> 01:36:48,239
from space coming here and doing

2594
01:36:50,709 --> 01:36:49,679
experiments

2595
01:36:53,669 --> 01:36:50,719
um

2596
01:36:56,790 --> 01:36:53,679
there's really no more evidence for that

2597
01:36:59,510 --> 01:36:56,800
than there is for the parallels between

2598
01:37:01,430 --> 01:36:59,520
ufos and fairies right like like if

2599
01:37:03,510 --> 01:37:01,440
we're just gonna look specifically at

2600
01:37:06,470 --> 01:37:03,520
the evidence you know what is the

2601
01:37:08,629 --> 01:37:06,480
evidence and and there's just as much

2602
01:37:11,750 --> 01:37:08,639
evidence for this

2603
01:37:12,590 --> 01:37:11,760
maybe more complex maybe more confusing

2604
01:37:14,629 --> 01:37:12,600
or

2605
01:37:17,030 --> 01:37:14,639
outlandish-sounding stuff as there is

2606
01:37:19,510 --> 01:37:17,040
for the extraterrestrial hypothesis or

2607
01:37:21,189 --> 01:37:19,520
other narratives that are that are a lot

2608
01:37:22,709 --> 01:37:21,199
easier to grasp i also like that you

2609
01:37:24,229 --> 01:37:22,719
mentioned that there are people who know

2610
01:37:27,030 --> 01:37:24,239
things and won't say things because that

2611
01:37:29,750 --> 01:37:27,040
is so true you know there is more that

2612
01:37:30,950 --> 01:37:29,760
is known than is discussed and i did

2613
01:37:33,590 --> 01:37:30,960
want to throw out there we've been

2614
01:37:34,390 --> 01:37:33,600
talking about this native american stuff

2615
01:37:46,790 --> 01:37:34,400
i

2616
01:37:49,109 --> 01:37:46,800
and uh

2617
01:37:50,310 --> 01:37:49,119
you know i i can't speak for them and i

2618
01:37:52,629 --> 01:37:50,320
think that there

2619
01:37:54,229 --> 01:37:52,639
are people with that perspective who

2620
01:37:56,149 --> 01:37:54,239
maybe have more insight on this than i

2621
01:37:58,470 --> 01:37:56,159
do

2622
01:38:01,109 --> 01:37:58,480
yeah yeah no and i've been hearing a lot

2623
01:38:03,910 --> 01:38:01,119
or more recently too on your show martin

2624
01:38:06,229 --> 01:38:03,920
about that kind of connection

2625
01:38:08,950 --> 01:38:06,239
with the metaphysical between different

2626
01:38:11,830 --> 01:38:08,960
mediums or aspects of it

2627
01:38:13,669 --> 01:38:11,840
and how it's all kind of seems connected

2628
01:38:16,149 --> 01:38:13,679
and i believe in that and i think what's

2629
01:38:19,189 --> 01:38:16,159
interesting is that before

2630
01:38:21,669 --> 01:38:19,199
modern times before the um

2631
01:38:24,629 --> 01:38:21,679
industrial revolution and all that

2632
01:38:25,990 --> 01:38:24,639
people were more prone to believe in the

2633
01:38:28,470 --> 01:38:26,000
mystical

2634
01:38:32,070 --> 01:38:28,480
and now because we have imperial

2635
01:38:34,470 --> 01:38:32,080
thought and you know like matter-based

2636
01:38:35,830 --> 01:38:34,480
science and evidence and all that stuff

2637
01:38:37,430 --> 01:38:35,840
based on you know

2638
01:38:39,270 --> 01:38:37,440
you know put it in a test tube it isn't

2639
01:38:41,750 --> 01:38:39,280
real a lot of people started to

2640
01:38:43,830 --> 01:38:41,760
disbelieve in that but

2641
01:38:46,070 --> 01:38:43,840
what i've learned and what i think also

2642
01:38:48,070 --> 01:38:46,080
exists in um

2643
01:38:51,030 --> 01:38:48,080
secret projects is that there is an

2644
01:38:51,910 --> 01:38:51,040
awareness of that of the metaphysical

2645
01:38:56,310 --> 01:38:51,920
and

2646
01:38:59,030 --> 01:38:56,320
can maybe

2647
01:39:01,030 --> 01:38:59,040
go in between and

2648
01:39:03,030 --> 01:39:01,040
go into different planes and all kinds

2649
01:39:04,229 --> 01:39:03,040
of stuff like that but

2650
01:39:06,470 --> 01:39:04,239
it's all

2651
01:39:08,629 --> 01:39:06,480
it's not separate we're not

2652
01:39:12,149 --> 01:39:08,639
it's it's not like we're just living in

2653
01:39:14,550 --> 01:39:12,159
an empire imperial imperial or whatever

2654
01:39:16,550 --> 01:39:14,560
version of reality based on modern

2655
01:39:18,790 --> 01:39:16,560
science i think that there's a whole

2656
01:39:21,830 --> 01:39:18,800
other area of science that's been

2657
01:39:24,229 --> 01:39:21,840
classified or that isn't encouraged to

2658
01:39:26,390 --> 01:39:24,239
the general public that explains these

2659
01:39:27,109 --> 01:39:26,400
things more in the interconnectedness of

2660
01:39:28,950 --> 01:39:27,119
it

2661
01:39:31,189 --> 01:39:28,960
and people that do the research will

2662
01:39:33,270 --> 01:39:31,199
find that there is a relation

2663
01:39:36,470 --> 01:39:33,280
between these things and maybe that's

2664
01:39:38,870 --> 01:39:36,480
why these myths have always existed

2665
01:39:41,030 --> 01:39:38,880
and older cultures accepted accepted it

2666
01:39:43,910 --> 01:39:41,040
more

2667
01:39:46,229 --> 01:39:43,920
well the line between science and uh and

2668
01:39:47,030 --> 01:39:46,239
magic is not a is not a hard and fast

2669
01:39:48,790 --> 01:39:47,040
line

2670
01:39:49,990 --> 01:39:48,800
you know someone a hundred years ago if

2671
01:39:51,750 --> 01:39:50,000
they could see

2672
01:39:53,830 --> 01:39:51,760
our technology today they would regard

2673
01:39:55,750 --> 01:39:53,840
it as magic and the technology of 100

2674
01:39:56,709 --> 01:39:55,760
years ago of 100 years from now in the

2675
01:39:58,870 --> 01:39:56,719
future

2676
01:40:00,070 --> 01:39:58,880
is something that that we would regard

2677
01:40:02,390 --> 01:40:00,080
as magic

2678
01:40:04,709 --> 01:40:02,400
um you know most people

2679
01:40:06,310 --> 01:40:04,719
people are so they get so caught up when

2680
01:40:08,950 --> 01:40:06,320
we talk about these mysteries and say

2681
01:40:11,109 --> 01:40:08,960
well i i won't believe it until i can

2682
01:40:13,430 --> 01:40:11,119
you know take it apart myself and see it

2683
01:40:15,910 --> 01:40:13,440
and it's like what percentage of people

2684
01:40:17,910 --> 01:40:15,920
know how your phone works or like the

2685
01:40:19,510 --> 01:40:17,920
electrical outlet in your house you plug

2686
01:40:21,510 --> 01:40:19,520
it in and like you know there's power

2687
01:40:22,709 --> 01:40:21,520
there do people really know

2688
01:40:23,830 --> 01:40:22,719
how that

2689
01:40:25,350 --> 01:40:23,840
what percentage of people really

2690
01:40:26,709 --> 01:40:25,360
understand how that electricity is

2691
01:40:29,350 --> 01:40:26,719
generated against your house and what

2692
01:40:31,030 --> 01:40:29,360
electricity is right you know there's

2693
01:40:33,669 --> 01:40:31,040
there's aspects of our own technology

2694
01:40:34,870 --> 01:40:33,679
that we use every day that very very few

2695
01:40:38,149 --> 01:40:34,880
people

2696
01:40:43,510 --> 01:40:40,390
that's right john thank you so much for

2697
01:40:45,750 --> 01:40:43,520
the uh call um i actually lived out in

2698
01:40:47,750 --> 01:40:45,760
los alamos for about six months years

2699
01:40:50,950 --> 01:40:47,760
ago and i used to like to go out to

2700
01:40:52,709 --> 01:40:50,960
bandelier and and also i was very

2701
01:40:55,350 --> 01:40:52,719
fascinated with the clip the cliff

2702
01:40:57,910 --> 01:40:55,360
dwellings and uh there's some actually

2703
01:40:59,189 --> 01:40:57,920
some i think there's some uh paintings

2704
01:41:01,350 --> 01:40:59,199
up in some of those

2705
01:41:02,830 --> 01:41:01,360
cliff cliff dwellings

2706
01:41:06,390 --> 01:41:02,840
is that right

2707
01:41:09,510 --> 01:41:06,400
john john is gone well thank you for the

2708
01:41:11,109 --> 01:41:09,520
call john the line is still open now and

2709
01:41:13,870 --> 01:41:11,119
that phone number is right up on the

2710
01:41:20,470 --> 01:41:16,550
855-472-5483 he was talking about

2711
01:41:22,790 --> 01:41:20,480
um underground but you know we're the

2712
01:41:25,590 --> 01:41:22,800
ocean is uh you know

2713
01:41:27,590 --> 01:41:25,600
70 um water is 70 of this planet it

2714
01:41:29,830 --> 01:41:27,600
seems like if these things can go in

2715
01:41:32,550 --> 01:41:29,840
between mediums and they actually need

2716
01:41:34,310 --> 01:41:32,560
to hide um maybe they don't need to hide

2717
01:41:37,350 --> 01:41:34,320
but maybe that is uh

2718
01:41:38,149 --> 01:41:37,360
that is a place for them but um before i

2719
01:41:39,590 --> 01:41:38,159
get

2720
01:41:42,390 --> 01:41:39,600
going in any other

2721
01:41:44,790 --> 01:41:42,400
tangent here we have spencer uh spencer

2722
01:41:46,310 --> 01:41:44,800
is calling from north carolina spencer

2723
01:41:49,590 --> 01:41:46,320
are you live on the air welcome to the

2724
01:41:52,550 --> 01:41:51,669
spencer

2725
01:41:58,870 --> 01:41:52,560
yes

2726
01:42:02,070 --> 01:41:58,880
hey how are you um i just had a question

2727
01:42:03,990 --> 01:42:02,080
about uh with all the ufo uh topics and

2728
01:42:06,229 --> 01:42:04,000
video coming out we haven't heard much

2729
01:42:08,629 --> 01:42:06,239
anything or anything else about it i was

2730
01:42:11,430 --> 01:42:08,639
curious to see what he thinks your guest

2731
01:42:12,950 --> 01:42:11,440
thinks will come from the ufo uh videos

2732
01:42:15,430 --> 01:42:12,960
or if there's anything else coming in

2733
01:42:18,470 --> 01:42:15,440
the media and why has it not been talked

2734
01:42:22,229 --> 01:42:20,149
well to be honest i i don't think

2735
01:42:23,270 --> 01:42:22,239
there's got to be more that comes out

2736
01:42:26,550 --> 01:42:23,280
and

2737
01:42:28,709 --> 01:42:26,560
look i'm not i have seen the reports

2738
01:42:31,910 --> 01:42:28,719
that have come out and the the videos

2739
01:42:33,750 --> 01:42:31,920
and um the eyewitness testimony i think

2740
01:42:35,109 --> 01:42:33,760
all of us interested in the subject have

2741
01:42:37,830 --> 01:42:35,119
seen this stuff

2742
01:42:38,629 --> 01:42:37,840
and i am a little bit skeptical about it

2743
01:43:07,990 --> 01:42:38,639
i

2744
01:43:10,470 --> 01:43:08,000
my um

2745
01:43:12,629 --> 01:43:10,480
like my social media feed i've got a lot

2746
01:43:14,229 --> 01:43:12,639
of friends on on facebook i follow a lot

2747
01:43:18,870 --> 01:43:14,239
of people on instagram and that stuff

2748
01:43:19,669 --> 01:43:18,880
isn't really full of great new ufo

2749
01:43:21,830 --> 01:43:19,679
um

2750
01:43:24,470 --> 01:43:21,840
photos and video at all you know most of

2751
01:43:26,390 --> 01:43:24,480
my friends are posting about uh you know

2752
01:43:29,189 --> 01:43:26,400
what they had for dinner or you know

2753
01:43:31,750 --> 01:43:29,199
concerns about covid they're not

2754
01:43:32,470 --> 01:43:31,760
sharing their ufo videos um

2755
01:43:34,229 --> 01:43:32,480
so

2756
01:43:36,629 --> 01:43:34,239
you know i i kind of i don't really

2757
01:43:38,390 --> 01:43:36,639
think we're living in a situation where

2758
01:43:40,229 --> 01:43:38,400
everybody is seeing this stuff all the

2759
01:43:42,629 --> 01:43:40,239
time

2760
01:43:44,950 --> 01:43:42,639
i just i think that the government uses

2761
01:43:47,750 --> 01:43:44,960
disinformation to

2762
01:43:50,390 --> 01:43:47,760
um to conceal i think they deliberately

2763
01:43:53,109 --> 01:43:50,400
propagate this information about ufos as

2764
01:43:54,950 --> 01:43:53,119
part of a uh a way to conceal what

2765
01:43:58,149 --> 01:43:54,960
they're doing and i think if ufo

2766
01:44:00,470 --> 01:43:58,159
sightings did wane if the ufo hype and

2767
01:44:02,229 --> 01:44:00,480
interest was flagging i wouldn't put it

2768
01:44:03,350 --> 01:44:02,239
past them to make something up to keep

2769
01:44:05,830 --> 01:44:03,360
it going

2770
01:44:08,390 --> 01:44:05,840
so you know i just i just really don't

2771
01:44:09,750 --> 01:44:08,400
know and of course um the future could

2772
01:44:11,990 --> 01:44:09,760
prove me wrong there could be some kind

2773
01:44:13,910 --> 01:44:12,000
of crazy disclosure tomorrow that takes

2774
01:44:14,950 --> 01:44:13,920
everybody by surprise i certainly didn't

2775
01:44:17,510 --> 01:44:14,960
predict

2776
01:44:19,669 --> 01:44:17,520
um the wave of kind of progressive

2777
01:44:21,030 --> 01:44:19,679
releases that we've seen in recent

2778
01:44:23,910 --> 01:44:21,040
months and years

2779
01:44:26,229 --> 01:44:23,920
um but you know i i think maybe they

2780
01:44:28,229 --> 01:44:26,239
feel like they've uh they've stoked the

2781
01:44:31,430 --> 01:44:28,239
flames enough and maybe they'll sit back

2782
01:44:33,109 --> 01:44:31,440
for a while and let us all uh dissect

2783
01:44:35,669 --> 01:44:33,119
and debate these sightings and and

2784
01:44:37,910 --> 01:44:35,679
videos and stuff until uh it's time to

2785
01:44:40,550 --> 01:44:37,920
throw us another bone

2786
01:44:43,270 --> 01:44:40,560
well um you know that may very well be

2787
01:44:45,830 --> 01:44:43,280
the case and uh thank you very much for

2788
01:44:47,990 --> 01:44:45,840
the call spencer we have another uh call

2789
01:44:50,390 --> 01:44:48,000
waiting uh dana from costa rica i'm

2790
01:44:51,189 --> 01:44:50,400
going to pull them up in just a second

2791
01:44:54,790 --> 01:44:51,199
um

2792
01:44:57,910 --> 01:44:54,800
but uh supposedly there's a 23-minute

2793
01:45:00,149 --> 01:44:57,920
video coming out and um i'm going to

2794
01:45:02,229 --> 01:45:00,159
grill lou alexander when i have him on

2795
01:45:04,390 --> 01:45:02,239
the show he knows about that and

2796
01:45:05,830 --> 01:45:04,400
supposedly there's several craft and all

2797
01:45:07,830 --> 01:45:05,840
that stuff which is

2798
01:45:10,550 --> 01:45:07,840
fascinating i hope we do get to see that

2799
01:45:12,550 --> 01:45:10,560
uh for right now though we have uh dan

2800
01:45:14,870 --> 01:45:12,560
on the line from costa rica dan you are

2801
01:45:16,790 --> 01:45:14,880
live on the air

2802
01:45:19,590 --> 01:45:16,800
hey chris it's crappy dan from long

2803
01:45:21,590 --> 01:45:19,600
beach clip 45 crew awesome great to hear

2804
01:45:23,990 --> 01:45:21,600
from you man how are you

2805
01:45:25,910 --> 01:45:24,000
awesome good man i'm watching i'm

2806
01:45:29,990 --> 01:45:25,920
watching you live here

2807
01:45:33,109 --> 01:45:30,000
super cool i can see your face

2808
01:45:34,470 --> 01:45:33,119
so my question is for you

2809
01:45:36,790 --> 01:45:34,480
um

2810
01:45:38,550 --> 01:45:36,800
what's your take on

2811
01:45:40,709 --> 01:45:38,560
atlantis

2812
01:45:44,310 --> 01:45:40,719
and the loomer

2813
01:45:44,320 --> 01:45:48,310
that's a good question uh

2814
01:45:51,350 --> 01:45:49,590
the uh

2815
01:45:52,790 --> 01:45:51,360
this kind of goes into

2816
01:45:54,229 --> 01:45:52,800
sort of what i was talking about earlier

2817
01:45:57,510 --> 01:45:54,239
with regard to

2818
01:46:00,790 --> 01:45:57,520
myth and folklore and method folklore

2819
01:46:02,790 --> 01:46:00,800
having a basis in in fact in historical

2820
01:46:05,109 --> 01:46:02,800
fact um

2821
01:46:07,350 --> 01:46:05,119
there is no doubt that there is

2822
01:46:08,870 --> 01:46:07,360
archaeological evidence under the

2823
01:46:10,950 --> 01:46:08,880
surface of the ocean

2824
01:46:12,790 --> 01:46:10,960
that pertains to

2825
01:46:14,790 --> 01:46:12,800
uh cities and civilizations that we

2826
01:46:16,629 --> 01:46:14,800
don't know anything about and

2827
01:46:19,270 --> 01:46:16,639
in the ancient world

2828
01:46:22,870 --> 01:46:19,280
atlantis was chronicled no differently

2829
01:46:24,870 --> 01:46:22,880
from the other great empires that we now

2830
01:46:27,030 --> 01:46:24,880
know where they were and and know you

2831
01:46:29,590 --> 01:46:27,040
know we we can dig up their cities and

2832
01:46:32,709 --> 01:46:29,600
we can go to a museum and see their art

2833
01:46:35,109 --> 01:46:32,719
and atlantis is this you know they're

2834
01:46:37,350 --> 01:46:35,119
hum i don't know how many times some

2835
01:46:39,830 --> 01:46:37,360
some tv documentary has come out and

2836
01:46:42,310 --> 01:46:39,840
it's like atlantis revealed you know we

2837
01:46:44,390 --> 01:46:42,320
found this underground city or

2838
01:46:46,709 --> 01:46:44,400
underwater city that was destroyed by a

2839
01:46:49,350 --> 01:46:46,719
tsunami or you know we believe that we

2840
01:46:52,070 --> 01:46:49,360
found in this desert somewhere the these

2841
01:46:54,629 --> 01:46:52,080
faint vestiges of some great city that

2842
01:46:56,149 --> 01:46:54,639
was abandoned because of some cataclysm

2843
01:46:56,870 --> 01:46:56,159
um

2844
01:47:02,870 --> 01:46:56,880
and

2845
01:47:04,870 --> 01:47:02,880
not sure that there ever will be because

2846
01:47:07,109 --> 01:47:04,880
with regard to human history it's just

2847
01:47:09,510 --> 01:47:07,119
there's just so much of it that we just

2848
01:47:12,390 --> 01:47:09,520
won't know anything about and um you

2849
01:47:15,990 --> 01:47:12,400
know the lemurians uh i kind of put them

2850
01:47:18,070 --> 01:47:16,000
in a category of these kind of folkloric

2851
01:47:20,390 --> 01:47:18,080
beings like i mentioned earlier the the

2852
01:47:22,149 --> 01:47:20,400
shaver mystery and the dyros which is

2853
01:47:24,149 --> 01:47:22,159
something that i i really kind of like

2854
01:47:26,229 --> 01:47:24,159
to talk about where

2855
01:47:28,870 --> 01:47:26,239
there's a lot of stories and a lot of

2856
01:47:31,189 --> 01:47:28,880
legends and a lot of folklore and then

2857
01:47:32,950 --> 01:47:31,199
there's this tantalizing

2858
01:47:34,790 --> 01:47:32,960
sort of possibility

2859
01:47:37,189 --> 01:47:34,800
that some of this stuff

2860
01:47:39,750 --> 01:47:37,199
uh represents real encounters that some

2861
01:47:42,950 --> 01:47:39,760
of this stuff is real where you might

2862
01:47:43,750 --> 01:47:42,960
find parallels between stories of people

2863
01:47:45,189 --> 01:47:43,760
who

2864
01:47:47,750 --> 01:47:45,199
never could have heard each other's

2865
01:47:49,350 --> 01:47:47,760
stories but who yet um came up with

2866
01:47:50,950 --> 01:47:49,360
something said something happened to

2867
01:47:53,590 --> 01:47:50,960
them some detail that seems oddly

2868
01:47:55,750 --> 01:47:53,600
specific that is is shared among these

2869
01:47:57,270 --> 01:47:55,760
stories and i think they're uh i think

2870
01:47:59,270 --> 01:47:57,280
it's really interesting

2871
01:48:01,350 --> 01:47:59,280
um but

2872
01:48:02,629 --> 01:48:01,360
it's it's a radical you know you really

2873
01:48:04,790 --> 01:48:02,639
can uh

2874
01:48:06,070 --> 01:48:04,800
get

2875
01:48:08,470 --> 01:48:06,080
and there's never going to be a real

2876
01:48:09,270 --> 01:48:08,480
answer

2877
01:48:11,030 --> 01:48:09,280
right

2878
01:48:14,709 --> 01:48:11,040
and it's

2879
01:48:17,109 --> 01:48:14,719
the discoveries in antarctica

2880
01:48:18,950 --> 01:48:17,119
i mean i think uh you know

2881
01:48:22,149 --> 01:48:18,960
i think there's a lot to find out about

2882
01:48:24,950 --> 01:48:22,159
antarctica there's um maps that seem to

2883
01:48:27,590 --> 01:48:24,960
show antarctica under the ice you know

2884
01:48:29,750 --> 01:48:27,600
things that no human could have known i

2885
01:48:32,709 --> 01:48:29,760
think to put it in in the most simple

2886
01:48:34,709 --> 01:48:32,719
terms possible i am convinced regardless

2887
01:48:36,950 --> 01:48:34,719
of aliens regardless of anything else i

2888
01:48:37,990 --> 01:48:36,960
am convinced that there is a tremendous

2889
01:48:40,070 --> 01:48:38,000
amount

2890
01:48:42,149 --> 01:48:40,080
of human history that we would be

2891
01:48:43,830 --> 01:48:42,159
shocked if we knew and i think that

2892
01:48:46,870 --> 01:48:43,840
there are a lot of things that we think

2893
01:48:48,629 --> 01:48:46,880
of as modern that were discovered in

2894
01:48:50,550 --> 01:48:48,639
prehistoric times and that maybe were

2895
01:48:52,870 --> 01:48:50,560
widely known about in prehistoric times

2896
01:48:54,470 --> 01:48:52,880
and we we just don't realize because so

2897
01:48:56,870 --> 01:48:54,480
much has been lost so much wasn't

2898
01:49:00,149 --> 01:48:56,880
written down or is under the ocean or

2899
01:49:02,709 --> 01:49:00,159
underground somewhere

2900
01:49:06,470 --> 01:49:03,669
chris

2901
01:49:08,229 --> 01:49:06,480
you're awesome thank you for what you do

2902
01:49:09,350 --> 01:49:08,239
it's good talking to you

2903
01:49:10,310 --> 01:49:09,360
good to talk to you man thank you for

2904
01:49:13,990 --> 01:49:10,320
calling

2905
01:49:16,070 --> 01:49:14,000
so that's going to be it for uh calls

2906
01:49:18,149 --> 01:49:16,080
for us tonight yeah all that stuff is

2907
01:49:20,629 --> 01:49:18,159
fascinating because there's there's so

2908
01:49:22,629 --> 01:49:20,639
many things that could have happened you

2909
01:49:25,350 --> 01:49:22,639
know i mentioned earlier the ice ages

2910
01:49:28,390 --> 01:49:25,360
there's been many but there's also the

2911
01:49:30,229 --> 01:49:28,400
moving of tectonic plates and um you

2912
01:49:31,669 --> 01:49:30,239
know and major earthquakes every time

2913
01:49:34,310 --> 01:49:31,679
there's you know

2914
01:49:36,229 --> 01:49:34,320
there's uh substantial movement on that

2915
01:49:40,070 --> 01:49:36,239
and you know the land mass is joining

2916
01:49:42,390 --> 01:49:40,080
together and then uh how under the ocean

2917
01:49:44,470 --> 01:49:42,400
i don't ever i've never really been able

2918
01:49:46,070 --> 01:49:44,480
to figure that out how the tectonic

2919
01:49:47,430 --> 01:49:46,080
plates moved if we were all if the

2920
01:49:49,589 --> 01:49:47,440
landmass was joined together and

2921
01:49:51,189 --> 01:49:49,599
separated then where does the ocean

2922
01:49:54,629 --> 01:49:51,199
floor come from you know that type of

2923
01:49:56,950 --> 01:49:54,639
thing is it all just churned up like a

2924
01:49:59,350 --> 01:49:56,960
you know like a rototiller uh you know

2925
01:50:00,709 --> 01:49:59,360
churning the the garden you know i mean

2926
01:50:03,109 --> 01:50:00,719
we're you know we're talking about

2927
01:50:05,270 --> 01:50:03,119
billions of years you know geologic time

2928
01:50:06,709 --> 01:50:05,280
we can't even grasp it

2929
01:50:08,870 --> 01:50:06,719
right it's uh

2930
01:50:10,070 --> 01:50:08,880
it's beyond our ability to understand

2931
01:50:12,390 --> 01:50:10,080
there was a story that you might have

2932
01:50:14,390 --> 01:50:12,400
seen in archaeology in the last month or

2933
01:50:15,910 --> 01:50:14,400
two about fossilized human footprints

2934
01:50:18,149 --> 01:50:15,920
that were found in mexico that were

2935
01:50:20,790 --> 01:50:18,159
dated much much earlier than we had

2936
01:50:22,390 --> 01:50:20,800
previously believed and this stuff is

2937
01:50:25,189 --> 01:50:22,400
just the tip of the iceberg you know the

2938
01:50:26,790 --> 01:50:25,199
more we investigate the further back

2939
01:50:29,430 --> 01:50:26,800
this number gets

2940
01:50:31,510 --> 01:50:29,440
um and i think someday even our most

2941
01:50:34,550 --> 01:50:31,520
basic ideas about where human beings

2942
01:50:36,229 --> 01:50:34,560
came from will be challenged uh i was

2943
01:50:38,229 --> 01:50:36,239
just talking about that with a friend

2944
01:50:41,030 --> 01:50:38,239
the other day you know like when you

2945
01:50:44,470 --> 01:50:41,040
hear scientists say that you know the

2946
01:50:47,030 --> 01:50:44,480
homo speci homo sapiens species us you

2947
01:50:49,189 --> 01:50:47,040
know are like 100 000 years old or 200

2948
01:50:49,990 --> 01:50:49,199
000 years old something like that to me

2949
01:50:55,589 --> 01:50:50,000
that

2950
01:50:59,189 --> 01:50:55,599
like evolution how things could develop

2951
01:51:01,189 --> 01:50:59,199
so quickly to become our species and

2952
01:51:03,030 --> 01:51:01,199
you know it's all baffling and i think

2953
01:51:05,990 --> 01:51:03,040
you're right i think we will know a lot

2954
01:51:08,229 --> 01:51:06,000
more someday and i think you know for

2955
01:51:10,149 --> 01:51:08,239
there's always going to be hesitancy to

2956
01:51:12,790 --> 01:51:10,159
rewrite history books

2957
01:51:14,310 --> 01:51:12,800
you know from the human development

2958
01:51:16,149 --> 01:51:14,320
there's always going to be

2959
01:51:17,750 --> 01:51:16,159
uh you know people fighting anything

2960
01:51:19,270 --> 01:51:17,760
that's discovered is what i'm saying

2961
01:51:20,390 --> 01:51:19,280
unfortunately they'll be part of science

2962
01:51:21,830 --> 01:51:20,400
that will

2963
01:51:25,030 --> 01:51:21,840
that's not how science is supposed to

2964
01:51:28,310 --> 01:51:25,040
work but that's how it actually can

2965
01:51:29,830 --> 01:51:28,320
the people adopt ideas in sets and you

2966
01:51:33,750 --> 01:51:29,840
know the science

2967
01:51:37,109 --> 01:51:33,760
is very sticky and it takes so much to

2968
01:51:38,709 --> 01:51:37,119
overturn these orthodoxies i mean when

2969
01:51:41,189 --> 01:51:38,719
you really start to look at some of the

2970
01:51:41,910 --> 01:51:41,199
fossil record for human ancestors and

2971
01:51:45,430 --> 01:51:41,920
for

2972
01:51:47,510 --> 01:51:45,440
where you've got

2973
01:51:50,229 --> 01:51:47,520
millions of years of time

2974
01:51:52,310 --> 01:51:50,239
represented by a single fossil fragment

2975
01:51:54,310 --> 01:51:52,320
you know a tooth or part of a cranium

2976
01:51:56,149 --> 01:51:54,320
it's like i think there's a tremendous

2977
01:51:57,350 --> 01:51:56,159
amount of hubris in thinking that we

2978
01:52:00,629 --> 01:51:57,360
know

2979
01:52:02,709 --> 01:52:00,639
are all answered and we figured it all

2980
01:52:05,189 --> 01:52:02,719
out i don't think we're there at all

2981
01:52:08,629 --> 01:52:05,199
and we do um by the way we do have

2982
01:52:11,430 --> 01:52:08,639
amnesia very you know we really don't

2983
01:52:13,669 --> 01:52:11,440
things don't seem to carry forward uh

2984
01:52:15,669 --> 01:52:13,679
very far you know you look at your own

2985
01:52:17,350 --> 01:52:15,679
ancestry you know how much do you know

2986
01:52:19,430 --> 01:52:17,360
about your great grandfather you know

2987
01:52:21,830 --> 01:52:19,440
that type of thing we we really don't

2988
01:52:24,709 --> 01:52:21,840
carry along you know thank goodness

2989
01:52:26,470 --> 01:52:24,719
there's documentation now but prior to

2990
01:52:27,830 --> 01:52:26,480
books and things like that you know

2991
01:52:29,350 --> 01:52:27,840
there were a lot of stories that were

2992
01:52:31,030 --> 01:52:29,360
never carried forward

2993
01:52:33,270 --> 01:52:31,040
and that's part of why i got into the

2994
01:52:35,510 --> 01:52:33,280
historical ufo cases because i think

2995
01:52:37,910 --> 01:52:35,520
that there's so much material there and

2996
01:52:40,470 --> 01:52:37,920
it's so important and uh

2997
01:52:41,990 --> 01:52:40,480
so little of it is kind of accessible

2998
01:52:43,430 --> 01:52:42,000
you know there's

2999
01:52:45,750 --> 01:52:43,440
there's the kind of the aspect of the

3000
01:52:47,030 --> 01:52:45,760
ufo investigator that's fun where you're

3001
01:52:49,430 --> 01:52:47,040
you're knocking on doors and saying

3002
01:52:50,870 --> 01:52:49,440
excuse me miss did you see you know an

3003
01:52:52,229 --> 01:52:50,880
alien in your yard or whatever but

3004
01:52:54,070 --> 01:52:52,239
there's this other aspect of it that's

3005
01:52:56,390 --> 01:52:54,080
maybe less glamorous where you're

3006
01:52:58,709 --> 01:52:56,400
trawling through microfilm rolls where

3007
01:53:01,589 --> 01:52:58,719
you're going through dusty newspapers

3008
01:53:03,350 --> 01:53:01,599
and finding um these clues you know i

3009
01:53:04,790 --> 01:53:03,360
it's it's not is

3010
01:53:06,550 --> 01:53:04,800
they're never going to make an x-files

3011
01:53:09,830 --> 01:53:06,560
episode about a guy who does research at

3012
01:53:11,910 --> 01:53:09,840
the library but there's so much to find

3013
01:53:14,070 --> 01:53:11,920
right chris has been fascinating i've

3014
01:53:16,790 --> 01:53:14,080
really enjoyed our conversation tonight

3015
01:53:18,229 --> 01:53:16,800
and i hope uh i hope we stay in touch

3016
01:53:20,149 --> 01:53:18,239
i would love it yeah thanks so much for

3017
01:53:21,589 --> 01:53:20,159
having me on this was great all right we

3018
01:53:23,669 --> 01:53:21,599
have to stay in touch with good we have

3019
01:53:24,950 --> 01:53:23,679
to see how things go after this

3020
01:53:26,470 --> 01:53:24,960
yeah let me know if something weird

3021
01:53:27,510 --> 01:53:26,480
happens yeah

3022
01:53:29,669 --> 01:53:27,520
oh no

3023
01:53:31,669 --> 01:53:29,679
all right thanks a lot you take care

3024
01:53:34,229 --> 01:53:31,679
thanks you too all right all right

3025
01:53:35,910 --> 01:53:34,239
everyone so that's it and next week as i

3026
01:53:37,910 --> 01:53:35,920
mentioned in the beginning of the show

3027
01:53:39,430 --> 01:53:37,920
i'll be out in arizona with a friend and

3028
01:53:41,669 --> 01:53:39,440
we're going to be

3029
01:53:43,990 --> 01:53:41,679
broadcasting our show live from there

3030
01:53:45,910 --> 01:53:44,000
with several mufon people thanks so much

3031
01:53:48,830 --> 01:53:45,920
everyone and remember to keep your eyes

3032
01:53:57,940 --> 01:53:48,840
to the sky